tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post5877409100324022311..comments2024-03-20T13:24:11.422+05:30Comments on Arunachala and Ramana Maharshi: Is the world real?David Godmanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10354181925332694222noreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-21338272522581099672012-09-26T22:48:48.422+05:302012-09-26T22:48:48.422+05:30**********************************
Why parroting:e...**********************************<br />Why parroting:everything is Maya, everything is Self is dangerous for Beginners<br />**********************************<br /><br />One understands wrong view as wrong view, and one understands right view as right<br />view. What is wrong view? The view that there is nothing given,<br />offered or sacrificed,13 no fruit or ripening of good and bad actions,no this world, no other world, no mother, no father, no apparitional beings, no good and virtuous monks and brahmans who have themselves realized by direct knowledge and declare this world and the other world: this is wrong view.<br /><br />"What is right view? There are two kinds of right view: there<br />is that affected by taints, which brings merit and ripens in the<br />essentials of existence; and there is the noble ones' right view without taints, which is supramundane and a factor of the path. What is right view affected by taints? The view that there is what is given, offered and sacrificed, and that there is fruit and ripening of<br />good and bad actions, and there is this world and the other world<br />and mother and father and apparitional beings and good and virtuous monks and brahmans who have themselves realized by direct<br />knowledge and declare this world and the other world: this is right<br />view affected by taints which brings merit and ripens in the essentials of existence. And what is the noble ones' right view? Any<br />understanding, understanding faculty, understanding power, investigation-of-states enlightenment factor, right view as path factor,<br />in one whose mind is ennobled and taintless, who possesses the<br />path, and who maintains it in being: this is the noble ones' right view without taints, which is supramundane and a factor of the<br />path."<br />M. 117<br />[From Life of the Buddha by Bhikku Nanamoli]Chakrihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03564584607595615980noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-45122663059453516152012-08-27T15:22:21.446+05:302012-08-27T15:22:21.446+05:30**********************************
From Anguttara ...**********************************<br />From Anguttara Nikaya translated by<br />Nyanaponika Thera and Bhikkhu Bodhi<br />www.scribd.com/Buddhist_Publication_Society<br />**********************************<br />56. The Four Unthinkables<br /><br />Monks, there are these four unthinkables,120 not to be pondered upon; which if pondered upon,<br />would lead one to insanity and distress. What are the four?<br />The range of a Buddha,121 O monk, is an unthinkable, not to be pondered upon; which, if<br />pondered upon, would lead one to insanity and distress.<br />The range of the meditative absorptions … the results of Kamma … speculations about the<br />world122 are unthinkables, not to be pondered upon, which if pondered upon, would lead to<br />insanity and distress.Chakrihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03564584607595615980noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-88730586339677049932012-04-18T08:30:20.379+05:302012-04-18T08:30:20.379+05:30This comment has been removed by the author.Ravihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14875076137584328729noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-5069625915971409782012-04-17T20:27:29.022+05:302012-04-17T20:27:29.022+05:30Sorry for the multiple posts.It was by mistake.
-...Sorry for the multiple posts.It was by mistake.<br /><br />-ZAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-22092621617218311052012-04-17T20:26:07.871+05:302012-04-17T20:26:07.871+05:30"One common mistake is to think that one real..."One common mistake is to think that one reality is the reality. You must always be prepared to leave one reality for a greater one." - <br /><br />Mother Meera, Answers, Part I<br /><br /><br />-ZAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-13440097244038884342012-04-17T20:25:25.465+05:302012-04-17T20:25:25.465+05:30"One common mistake is to think that one real..."One common mistake is to think that one reality is the reality. You must always be prepared to leave one reality for a greater one." - <br /><br />Mother Meera, Answers, Part I<br /><br /><br />-ZAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-3608376304705624912012-04-17T20:25:06.464+05:302012-04-17T20:25:06.464+05:30"One common mistake is to think that one real..."One common mistake is to think that one reality is the reality. You must always be prepared to leave one reality for a greater one." - <br /><br />Mother Meera, Answers, Part I<br /><br /><br />-ZAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-76790179946820858252012-04-17T20:24:35.992+05:302012-04-17T20:24:35.992+05:30"One common mistake is to think that one real..."One common mistake is to think that one reality is the reality. You must always be prepared to leave one reality for a greater one." - <br /><br />Mother Meera, Answers, Part I<br /><br /><br />-ZAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-40345606211848377402012-04-17T20:24:10.570+05:302012-04-17T20:24:10.570+05:30"One common mistake is to think that one real..."One common mistake is to think that one reality is the reality. You must always be prepared to leave one reality for a greater one." - <br /><br />Mother Meera, Answers, Part I<br /><br /><br />-ZAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-18828046852830042802012-04-17T20:23:44.722+05:302012-04-17T20:23:44.722+05:30"One common mistake is to think that one real..."One common mistake is to think that one reality is the reality. You must always be prepared to leave one reality for a greater one." - <br /><br />Mother Meera, Answers, Part I<br /><br /><br />-ZAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-14787242371460172602012-04-17T20:23:14.618+05:302012-04-17T20:23:14.618+05:30"One common mistake is to think that one real..."One common mistake is to think that one reality is the reality. You must always be prepared to leave one reality for a greater one." - <br /><br />Mother Meera, Answers, Part I<br /><br /><br />-ZAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-87199206196029932132011-09-07T20:28:29.387+05:302011-09-07T20:28:29.387+05:30Chapter 12 of Bhikkhu Ñanamoli's classic compi...Chapter 12 of Bhikkhu Ñanamoli's classic compilation, The Life of the Buddha according to the Pali Canon.<br />********************************<br />Once too the wanderer Uttiya went to the Blessed One, and after greeting him, he sat down at one side. Then he asked: "How is it, Master Gotama, the world is eternal: is only that the truth and everything else wrong?" -- "That is not answered by me, Uttiya." -- "Then the world is not eternal: is only that the truth and everything else wrong?" -- "That too is not answered by me, Uttiya." -- "The world is finite: is only that the truth and everything else wrong?" -- "That too is not answered by me, Uttiya." -- "Then the world is infinite: is only that the truth and everything else wrong?" -- "That too is not answered by me, Uttiya." -- "The soul is the same as the body: is only that the truth and everything else wrong?" -- "That too is not answered by me, Uttiya." -- "Then the soul is one and the body another: is only that the truth and everything else wrong?" -- "That too is not answered by me, Uttiya." -- "After death a Perfect One is: is only that the truth and everything else wrong?" -- "That too is not answered by me, Uttiya." -- "Then after death a Perfect One is not: is only that the truth and everything else wrong?" -- "That too is not answered by me, Uttiya." -- "Then after death a Perfect One both is and is not: is only that the truth and everything else wrong?" -- "That too is not answered by me, Uttiya." -- "Then after death a Perfect One neither is nor is not: is only that the truth and everything else wrong?" -- "That too is not answered by me, Uttiya."<br /><br />"But why does Master Gotama decline to answer when I ask him these questions? What then is answered by Master Gotama?"<br /><br />"I teach the Dhamma to disciples from direct knowledge, Uttiya, for the purification of beings, for surmounting sorrow and lamentation, for ending pain and grief, for attainment of the true goal, for realizing Nibbana."<br /><br />"Master Gotama, does that Dhamma provide an outlet from suffering for all the world, or for half, or for a third?"<br /><br />When this was said, the Blessed One remained silent.<br /><br />Then the Venerable Ananda thought: "The wanderer Uttiya must not conceive any such pernicious view as 'When the monk Gotama is asked a question peculiar to me and to no one else and he founders and does not answer, is it because he is unable?' That would be long for his harm and suffering." So he said to him: "Friend Uttiya, I shall give you a simile; for some wise men here get to know through a simile the meaning of what is said.<br /><br />"Suppose a king had a city with strong ditches, ramparts and bastions, and a single gate, and he had a wise, clever, sagacious gate-keeper there who stopped those whom he did not know and admitted only those whom he knew; and since he had himself gone round the path encircling the city and had seen no gaps in the ramparts or any hole even big enough for a cat to pass through, he might conclude that living beings above a certain size must go in and out through the gate -- so too, friend Uttiya, a Perfect One's concern is not that 'All the world shall find an outlet by this, or a half, or a third,' but rather that 'Whoever has found or finds or will find an outlet from the world of suffering, that is always done by abandoning the five hindrances (of desire for sensuality, ill will, lethargy-and-drowsiness, agitation-and-worry, and uncertainty), defilements that weaken understanding, and by maintaining in being the seven factors of enlightenment with minds well established on the four foundations of mindfulness.'<br /><br />"Your question which you put to the Blessed One was framed in the wrong way; that was why the Blessed One did not answer it."<br /><br />AN 10:95Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-75499909687579699512009-01-27T04:57:00.000+05:302009-01-27T04:57:00.000+05:30Real and Unreal can only be two extremes of of one...Real and Unreal can only be two extremes of of one thing as is the case with all "opposites". Every definition requires further definition ad infinitum. Language is handy but almost useless when trying to define abstractions.rgnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00796408005020988387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-54426384640040750182009-01-26T20:51:00.000+05:302009-01-26T20:51:00.000+05:30re: spiritual languagesi recently sent an e-mail t...re: spiritual languages<BR/><BR/>i recently sent an e-mail to a friend on the topic of the need to employ more than one viewpoint to understand our experiences. i'm including it below and i'd be interested in hearing what others think about this approach. the reference to Bhagavan's comments in the p.s. are his discussion of the different vadas which describe the status of the world.<BR/><BR/>---<BR/><BR/>sometimes i picture the self as being in the middle of a diamond. each facet is like a different way of looking in at the self, a window with a slightly different orientation than its neighbors. one of the best facets is the one we call 'language'. there are several other good ones, like 'states of mind', 'here and now' and 'subject and object', as well.<BR/><BR/>the words of great teachers are usually hard to follow because they switch languages according to who they're talking to. the result is a mix of different viewpoints, which seems to be very inconsistent in meaning. i think that if we start off with the understanding that no one language or viewpoint can locate the self it makes things easier. if we're able to alternate between three of them, we can get a fix on it.<BR/><BR/>these languages are just our own different ways of describing what's happening at a particular moment. they naturally alternate as we go through the day. for example, if you ask me about the tree falling in the forest at 3pm i'll be in the waking state, so an honest description would probably be "yes, it makes a sound - science can prove it". if you somehow manage to ask me at midnight while i'm dreaming, i might say "no, it makes no sound - that part of my dream is gone forever". and if you could ask me at 3am while i'm sleeping i'd say "what tree?" each one of these is an honest attempt to describe what's happening at that moment, but they're very different.<BR/><BR/>any question whose answer can be reduced to "it depends on what time of day you ask me" is not the self, so what remains is the self, the solid background upon which these different viewpoints come and go.<BR/><BR/>i think the main thing to remember about these different vedantic 'dialects' is that they're nothing special, mystical or outside. they're just you and i honestly attempting to describe "what's happening now" under different conditions.<BR/><BR/>ps<BR/><BR/>i'm attaching something that Ramana said about the three viewpoints or languages. instead of describing different points on the daily cycle, as i did above, he's describing different levels of maturity of the listener, but it amounts to the same thing.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-65844228166011858892009-01-21T03:49:00.000+05:302009-01-21T03:49:00.000+05:30Scott Fraundorf:It may have been a pointless thing...Scott Fraundorf:<BR/><BR/>It may have been a pointless thing to do, but I put several threads on Richard Dawkins atheist forum about nonduality in regards to religion. the first one I put up, titled What is Real? ended up with almost 600 comments, which I thought was sort of cool. I did my best to explain Advaita Vedanta, and quoted Maharshi, sometimes from this site. When I commented too much, as I sometimes do, I think I killed the mystery of what my perspective was that was driving it. I took a gander at deconstructing some of their Only Objective Atheist Mindset, using scientific anecdotes.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-32118707122976020702009-01-19T18:18:00.000+05:302009-01-19T18:18:00.000+05:30David,This post is so wonderful that i've permanen...David,<BR/><BR/>This post is so wonderful that i've permanently linked to it from my blog sidebar.<BR/><BR/>Thank you.<BR/><BR/>Captcha: nexuarrరామ ShastriXhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02346962668892418943noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-6676947997154478162008-08-25T00:10:00.000+05:302008-08-25T00:10:00.000+05:30David,perhaps they are saying both in two 'dialect...David,<BR/><BR/>perhaps they are saying both in two 'dialects' of ajata, in which one is more uncompromising than the other. in the language of purest ajata, it seems that (b) would be favored. <BR/><BR/>in terms of direct experience, i've also seen that (b) is true. are you aware of others who have spoken of this?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-59084503914483910332008-08-24T09:15:00.000+05:302008-08-24T09:15:00.000+05:30michael said... David, in ajatic terms, is t...michael said...<BR/><BR/> David,<BR/><BR/> in ajatic terms, is there such a thing as 'life' or even 'Life'?<BR/><BR/><BR/><BR/>That which comes and goes is not 'real' because it lacks permanence. Under this strict definition 'life' is not real because it fails the threefold test of reality that I outlined in the post.<BR/><BR/>However, as I pointed out in the post, if temporary phenomena are directly experienced as being one's own Self, then one may grant them reality, but only so long as they are known and experienced in that way.<BR/><BR/>I have gone through the main ajata texts and arguments and I have discussed them with people who claim expertise in this field. I still cannot decide whether they are saying that (a) creation never happened except in the imagination or (b) creation never happened at all, even in imagination. Position (a) would allow one to claim some sort of reality for phenomena such as 'life', so long as it was directly experienced as one's own Self. Position (b) would exclude that possibility.David Godmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10354181925332694222noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-76499587380538415422008-08-24T07:51:00.000+05:302008-08-24T07:51:00.000+05:30David,in ajatic terms, is there such a thing as 'l...David,<BR/><BR/>in ajatic terms, is there such a thing as 'life' or even 'Life'?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-85463362769358382522008-05-25T11:34:00.000+05:302008-05-25T11:34:00.000+05:30I follow Bhagavan's policy on this one. I never as...I follow Bhagavan's policy on this one. I never ask for donations, or even hint that they can be made. However, if people want to give money for a particular project, or to finance my work in general, I usually accept, so long as there are no strings attached.David Godmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10354181925332694222noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3961358105214008284.post-41168556966461760012008-05-25T11:07:00.000+05:302008-05-25T11:07:00.000+05:30David,Thanks so much for this blog. It is wonderf...David,<BR/><BR/>Thanks so much for this blog. It is wonderful reading. Your books have been so important in my own search - to now have you here "live" is an unexpected treat.<BR/><BR/>Although I have in some way contributed to the continuation of your work through book purchases, I would consider it an honor to donate more directly. Please consider setting up some sort of PayPal or other means, or if there is already some route then making it more obvious.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com