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Sri Ramana Maharshi
Welcome
I propose to use this blog primarily to air my occasional musings on any matters relating to the life and teachings of Ramana Maharshi. There will also be occasional contributions about Arunachala, the sacred mountain where Sri Ramana spent all of his adult life.
Articles and interviews on these topics can also be found on my site: www.davidgodman.org.
Articles and interviews on these topics can also be found on my site: www.davidgodman.org.
966 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 601 – 800 of 966 Newer› Newest»in my GRE test study book, it's a test to get into grad.school, one of the sentences which was to be evaluated whether it makes sense involved Swami Vivikenanda. I thought that was pretty cool!
My teacher's mandala's.
Mandala Two
Consciousness
Consciousness alone ever is.
Being and Consciousnes
Are one and the same.
Subtlest, vastest, self-luminous,
Consciousness ever is.
None know it.
It knows all.
It knows itself.
Only Consciousness can know itself.
Nothing else can do so.
Consciousness requires no other light
Other than itself to illumine itself.
Consciousness alone ever is.
As the sun does not cease to shine.
When a cloud passes before it,
Consciousness shines uninterruptedly,
Beyond all concepts and obscuration.
Never is there a cloudy day
For the sun itself.
Identify with the sun
Of ever-shining Consciousness.
That which illumines thoughts,
Sensory perceptions, and all experience
Is known by none of htese.
None knows it.
It knows all.
It knows itself.
Consciusness alone shines
Formless and infinite.
Consciousness alone ever is.
The unknown Knower of all that is known,
The supreme Knowledge itself,
Consciousness remains undivided
By the triad of knower, knowing, and known.
A known or unknown object
Consciousness can never be.
Of all, Consciousness is
The Witness, the only Knower.
Consciousness, the Knower.
Is never defined by the known.
The Witness of all thought, of every state,
Not defined by any thought,
Not contained in any state,
The Witness is never the known,
For Consciousness is ever nonobjective.
Consciousness is formless--
Nothing objective within or without it.
Unknown, it alone is known.
Not a process of knowing,
It alone is knowing,
Not a knower,
It alone is the Knower,
The unknown Knower of all that is known.
Consciousness alone is That.
The uncaused cause of all,
It remains without all.
Now and forever, Consciousness shines;
The origin of the universe
Is the origin of one's present experience.
Consciousness alone is That.
All things originate from
That which is not a thing.
All thoughts derive from
That which is not any of htem.
All things are dissolved in
That which is indestructible.
That is formless and inconceivable.
Consciousess alone is That.
Consciousness alone is
The true nature of the mind.
Unknown, it seems as if
A mind composed of thoughts.
Thoughts are unreal,
And so is a mind.
Consciousness alone is.
Thought is only Consciousness,
Yet, Consciousness is not thought.
Consciousness is not mere thought,
But is one and infinite,
Indivisible and undifferentiated.
Multiplicity of thought
Is not multiplicity of Consciousness.
Differences of thought
Are not differentiation of Consciousness.
Division of thought
Is not division of Consciousness.
Liberation of thought
Is the innate freedom of Consciousness
Freedom from thought
Is no mere mental mode,
But identity as Consciousness.
The true cessation of thought
Is the realization of its nonexistence ever,
For Consciousness alone is.
As a picture of a lamp
Offers no light,
So no thought of its own
Has any power to know.
Self-luminous Consciousness is
The one Light, ever shining,
Infinite, clear, and ever free.
That which knows
The presence and absence
Of thoughts is netiher.
Neither obscures or clarifies That,
For That is the sole Reality,
Pure Being and Bliss,
With no mode or modification;
Consciousness alone is.
The undivided Consciousness
Without a second, is all.
There is no experience,
Gross or subtle,
Outer or inner,
Lower or higher
Apart from Consciousness
Consciousness alone
Is all ever,
Does all ever,
Is the space in which
Appears all ever.
Consciousness alone appears
As all this experience.
Known as it is, transcendent of all,
Consciousness has no apperance whatsoever.
All experience rises, appears, and dissolves in Consciousness,
Which has no rise, appearance, or dissolution.
He who knows the Truth of the SElf
Has neither birth nor death,
Neither attachment nor fear,
For he is one with
The undivided Consciousness.
Timeless and still,
The SElf ever is,
Of the nature of Consciousness,
Existence-Knowledge-Infinity.
Consciousness is called the cause:
Unknown, it is
The cause of all illusion,
And is itself the illusion,
For other substance there is none;
Known, it is
The cause of all Knowledge
And is itself the Knowledge,
For other knowledge there is none.
To doubt the existence of Consciousness
Is like seeing colors,
But doubting the existence of the eyes,
Or declaring aloud
Belief in words just spoken,
But doubting whether or not
One has a mouth,
Or listening to notes,
But doubting the hearing,
Or savoring the flavor
But doubting the tasting,
Or enjoying the fragrance blown by the breeze,
But ignoring the sensing.
The eye of the eye, unseen by the eye,
The ear of the ear, unheard by the ear,
The unsensed by the senses,
The unthought by the mind,
Consciousness is, the silent and still.
Swifter than the moment,
More enduring than the eons,
Consciousness is
Timeless and still.
The fourth and beyond
Is the Self continous,
Formless, transcendent,
Beyond body and mind.
In it the three states
Waking, dreaming, deep sleep,
With all they contain,
Appear, as the illusion
Of motion in the ever still,
Of form in the Formless,
Of modification of That
Which is ever immutable.
The changes of states
Change not the Self,
Just as the alternation
Of darkness and light
Is not the space,
The infinite Consciousness,
Beyond the three,
Alone is real,
Not sleeping while sleeping,
Not dreaming while dreaming,
Not waking while waking,
Turiya and Turiyatita,
The Fourth and Beyond.
Consciousness is, indeed, alone is.
First, see Consciousness
Contains all ever experienced.
Then, see Consciousness
Is all it contains
Then, see Consciousness
Forever unmodified
And there is no all
For it to contain,
Consciousness is, indeed, alone is.
I was just thinking about how Maharshi had said that grief at the loss of a loved one betrays love of the object not the real Self of that person. There is something really beautiful and liberating about that. The way to really love others is to abide in the Self, which is them, is how I take it. Because when loving the object, their body, I'm loving the object, which is not them, just as my body, is not me. The real them never dies, the real me never dies. So I can safely stop worrying about the forms of others, as giving up attachment to their forms is not really giving up them. In fact I would be abiding in the real resideing place of the ones I love, total communion with them. So my logic goes. Just like happiness is within, communion with others within. So if everything is within, there is no reason not to dive within. And everything is more attainable. Communion with others, requires them being alive, it requires them being on good terms with me, or two forms being on good terms with eachother. But if happiness and communion with everything and everyone is within, in the Self, then everything desired, dreamed about is attainable, and it is attainable immediately, and is not precarious where forms are precarious.
this was my teacher's latest response. I thought I'd share it.
Dear Kassy,
Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya
Namaste. Thank you for your numerous recent messages.
Your messages express both worthwhile spiritual reflection and
repetitive patterns of thought. They do not have equal validity. One
reflects that which is true and profound, while the other is mere repetition
of imagination given undue emphasis. The latter is based on egoism and
non-comprehension of the source of happiness and lends itself to worldly
craving and fear. The former is of the nature of sattva and points in the
right direction, which is the nirguna (quality-less) Truth. Examine the play
of your mind, discern, and direct accordingly.
At the root of your ideas are the definitions that are
misidentifications. The root of all misidentifications is the assumption of
individuality, or ego. Inquire to become free of all of them.
The abandonment of misidentifications reveals the true Self. Such is
inquiry.
The Self is actionless. It remains so regardless of the activity or
inactivity of the body. Likewise is the Bliss of the Self.
That which is vast, eternal, deep, infinite, utterly beyond the
personality and its concerns, bliss itself, illimitable Consciousness,
formless, constant, imperishable, and nondual, and so knowing which there is
nothing else to experience, is ever cherished by the wise. Focused on that,
devoted to that, inquiring to know that, finding the utter insignificance of
all else in light of that, with that as their support, delighting in that,
absorbed in that, the wise realize that to be the sole-existent Reality and
remain completely content, as peace in the perfect fullness.
Ever yours in Truth,
Nome
I was reading The Power of The Presence and there was something fulfilling about it. One thing is to read about these devotees who are just as immersed in samsara as I am, trying to grapple with the profound instructions of the Maharshi, that are pushing them beyond their limits. And I recognize the same instruction in the way this teacher instructs toward me. It's kind of this uphill push, and I was noticing ,that with Rangan, Akhilandamma and Sadhu Natananda. My teacher only speaks from the Reality of Brahman, and the sanity of it is obvious, it's common sensical, these "whirling vasanas" do not serve me. But I can relate to the sentiments of these devotees, like Rangan who said "What can I do Bhagavan? If your son is a dud and a dunce?" On some level I know, as I'm sure we all do, when we are dwelling in ignorance (it doesn't require any religious dogma to know our moods, and thoughts and desires are not serving us well), but it really takes a jnani to be able to say it in a way, that those excuses no longer seem valid, in a way that we can listen to. Something like there is only the Blissful substratum has a common sense ring to it. Because these forms appeared and will dissapear. But even having some intuition of this, the attachments pull so stronly, and arise aggressively. Who could fight them without the aid of an "external" jnani? And really, each of these devotees like us, is engaged in this epic battle (life and death struggle) with their vasanas, with Maharshi being the light to guide them. And I see that now, re-reading this, the epic-ness, the confusion in each of their tales, and the profound and perfect guide that Maharshi was, and all jnanis are. There were times, where I recognized that Maharshi was always pushing devotees in a way I didn't notice before. He was always pushing them beyond their current state. Especially with his family. And in my teacher's last reply you see this, he doesn't give any scope for my excuses, how potent I think my vasanas are, and how powerless I think I am. Also how Maharshi wouldn't validate things that were inessential, such as the ritual in front of him. It was also interesting because Maharshi used a lost key as an analogy for instruction, my teacher did too, because I left the key in the outside mailbox to the apartment was staying at, and the person in charge of the apartments couldn't find it. I said, "I left in the outside mailbox". He said in e-mail response, "Thank you, she found the key, and you have also found the key. You just need to use it deeply and continously", responding to my re-capping what I understand of inquiry as eliminating the non-eternal.
Nanangaru's expression of the Truth is really beautiful.
Nannagaru is clearly a jnani, I have no doubt. But watching the clips on youtube, or google video, he doesn't speak English, and sadly that is my only langauge. Even though my brother in law and his family is from Andre Pradesh and speak Telegu. But on the Nannagaru website, there are articles that are from live discourses that he gave, and I have to say that they are deeply inspiring. The mix of religious devotion and inquiry is well articulated. Earlier I almost posted one. He starts off every discourse with "dear soul mates". Reading things like this, I feel like helps make clear the blissful one reality, and the importance of attempting to realize it.
I remember Ravi's quote of Ramakrishna, "go play football". It happens I'm going to do that, the American kind with the oval ball. I was always really good at throwing a football, so I'm going to try to be a quarterback in a local amateur league.
This is from my teacher's commentary book, The Essence of Enquiry, which is his commentary on the dialogues of Maharshi's Self-inquiry essay.
Disciple: What are the limbs of yoga?
The Maharshi: Yama, niyama, asana, pranayama, pratyahara, dharana, dhyana, and samadhi. Of these--
(1) Yama:--this stands for the cultivation of such principles of good conduct as non-violence (ahimsa), truth (satya), non-stealing (asteya), celibacy (brah-macharya), and non-possession (aparigraha).
Commentary:
Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya
The limbs of yoga are named and the traditional techniques are described. Yama involves the abstention from activities that are the crude forms of ignorance. Yama is not only for the purpose of good karma and elimination of bad karma, but it is for the purpose of eliminating from the mind the causes of that from which one abstains. One must be first free from anger, wrath, or frustration; dishonesty and insincerity; greed and avarice; lust or craving; and possessiveness and attachment in order to attain union (yoga) with the Supreme. One who practices yama should advance to feel that such is no "abstention" but is natural.
The Maharshi:
(2) Niyama:--- this stands for the observance of such rules of good conduct as purity (saucha), contentment (santosha), austerity (tapas), study of the sacred texts (svadhyaya), and devotion to God (Isvara-pranidhana).
Commentary:
Niyama is next described. Purity extends from right intention and relates to sattva. What constitutes purity is dealt with extensively and in various manners in many scriptures. Contentment should be the basic attitude of one who is intent upon Realization, who knows that the objects and conditions of the world are unrelated to one's happiness and peace, and who is diving within to experience that happiness and peace. With santosha one does not make a grievance over what does not please one, but rather one develops greater detachment and relinquishes the tendency of opining with the mind. Tapas is fiery practice, the light of which destroys the darkness of ignorance, the heat of which melts or burns all of delusion's dross. It may also be understood as austerity, the physical act of which by itself is not much significance, but when based upon non-attachment and fascination with the Bliss of the Self is truly glorious.
The study of the sacred texts, be they Veda-s or Agama-s, Siva Rahasya or Mahabharata, Upanisad-s or Purana-s, teachings of wise Sages or legends about the divine, informs the mind of what should be known. Though the REalization of the Self is ineffable, it is a great blessing for aspirants that such texts exist and have been preserved, giving description to the ineffable, conveying Knowledge about the non-conceptual, inspiring and illuminating the reader. Such scriptural study should be done meditatively with an aim to enter the experience of the Knowledge revealed and to have the inner darsanam of the sages whose utterances are contained therein. Quality of texts read is utterly insignificant. To experience what is related in the scriptures is what is of utmost importance. Lastly, devotion to God is mentioned. This attentuates the ego and is the support and purpose of the other aspects of niyama. One should realize that God is alone real and devotion to God alone matters; the ego and its concerns are utterly insiginificant.
The Maharshi:
(3) Asana:--Of the different postures, eighty-four are the main ones. Of these, again, four, viz., simha, bhadra, padma, and siddha, are said to be excellent. Of these two, it is only siddha that is the most excellent. Thus the yoga-texts declare.
Commentary:
The various asana-s are regarded as having various effects upon one's meditation, especially in the subtle sense, until one abandons misidentification with the body and the introversion of the mind no longer depends on posture, activity, etc. The aim of asana should be to attain a state in which meditation continues undisturbed by bodily posture. Once one has transcended the attachment to the body or to the sensations of the body, asana is irrelevent. The Self itself has no asana.
The Maharshi:
(4) Pranayama:-- According to the measures prescribed in the sacred texts, exhaling the vital air is rechaka, inhaling is puraka and retaining it in the heart is kumbhaka. As regards "measure," some texts say that rechaka and puraka should be equal in measure, and kumbhaka twice that measure, while other texts say that if rechaka is one measure, puraka should be of two measures, and kumbhaka of four. By "measure" what is meant is the time that would be taken for the utterance of the Gayatrimantra once. thus pranayama consisting of rechaka, puraka, and kumbhaka should be practiced daily according to ability, slowly and gradually. Then, there would arise for the mind a desire to rest in happiness without moving. After this, one should practice pratyahara.
Commentary:
The aim behind pranayama has already been explained. The direct path to Self-REalization has also already been explained. Explained, too, are the reasons to practice and not to practice yoga methods and the invariable necessity for Self-inquiry yielding Self-Knowledge. Thus, in Bhgavan's Tamil rendition of Devikalottara, v.16, it is stated, "Holding of the breath, muttering of a miscellany of mantra-s, practices such as stambhava (stoppage of vital air movements), concentration, all these those desirous of undecaying Liberation do not have to endeavor to cultivate." In the Sanskrit Sri Devikalottare (Jnanacare-Vicara Patalah), the same verse is, "Holding the breath, miscellany of mantra-s, controlling the vital airs, and concentration of the mind, all such should not be practiced by one who desires undecaying Liberation"
Here details of control of prana through manipulation of the rhythm of the breath are described. Pranayama is also practiced at the time of japa (repetition of mantra) of Gayatrimantra by those who are initiated into it, and the time of one repetition is here utilized as a unit of measure. The mantra itself is,
Om bhur bhuvah svah
tat savitur varenyam
bhargo devasya dhimahi
dhiyo yo nah pracodayat
The first line is recited with it, though the remainder alone is properly the Gayatri as it appears in Rg Veda III, 62:10. The significance of it is Om, the earth, the atmosphere, and the heavens (the meditator should contemplate all of these at once). The Savitur (God as the Light of the sun, associated with the time right before dawn, the vivifier) is the God to be worshipped (or upon which we meditate); may it enlighten (or actuate) our minds.
Once the desire to find happiness becomes the desire for the mind to rest unmovingly in Bliss, once proceeds beyond the domain of prana to pratyahara.
The Maharshi:
(5) Pratyahara:-- This is regulating the mind by preventing it from flowing towards the external names and forms. The mind, which had been till then distracted, now becomes controlled. The aids in this respect are (1) meditation on the pranava, (2) fixing the attention betwixt the eye-brows, (3) looking at the tip of the nose, and (4) reflection on the nada. The mind that has thus become one-pointed will be fit to stay in one place. After this, dharana should be practiced.
Commentary:
if the mind ceases to be fixated on the external forms and ideas about them, it liberates itself from the senses and is no longer distracted by them. Meditation will be firm and steady for one who does not abandon it just because some sensory impression, such as a sound, a sight, a sensation, a taste, or a scent, has occured. Such a one feels, "There have been countless sensory experiences. None of them endure; none of them are happiness or peace. Why focus upon them when it is the Self that is to be Realized?"
However, since the aforementioned ripeness for inquiry into the Self is considreed as missing for the seeker about whom these series of questions and answers are concerned, other techniques to catch the mind's attention are mentioned. By holding on to them, the mind will not drift along the channels of the old tendencies to fixate on unreal sense objects.
Pranava refers to meditation on Om. This can be performed as meditation upon the sound Om, or as meditation on Om as continuous, eternal, and pervading the entire universe, or as that which exists as "the higher and lower" as Dattatreya declares in Avadhuta Gita, and constituting yet transcending the three states revealed by the Mandukya Upanisad with the Karika by Sri Gaudapada, "The letter Om is all this...All that is past, present or future is only Om. That which is beyond the three times is also only Om". 1:1 "Om is Brahman, beyond fear" 1:25 "Om is Brahman. Om is all of this." (Taittiriya Upanisad, 1:8:1) "Om is indeed all this." Chandogya Upanisad II, 33:3;) "Medutate on the Self thus with the help of Om." (Mundaka Upanisad 2:6)
That is enough for now.
Scott,
"It happens I'm going to do that, the American kind with the oval ball. I was always really good at throwing a football, so I'm going to try to be a quarterback in a local amateur league."
Scott,wish you the Very Best.I remember how Professor Randy Pausch wondered what his Coach was upto when he did not use a Football for coaching!How he said-'Well there are eleven+Eleven players and most of the time you may not be in contact with the Ball'!
It does look like that there is a lot to learn from this game.
Namaskar.
I can't really imagine living without a guru. I was just thinking, it's not just in pursuit of enlightenment, but just living life wisely and sanely. I relate with Dr. Syed who was both a devotee of Papaji and Ramana Maharshi, and had gurus in previous lives. I can even relate that Dr. Syed used his relationship with these sages over mundane matters. At first I felt superior when I read that in Nothing Ever Happened. But now it makes total sense. Once there is the guru-devotee relationship, it seems like something to have until Realization which may be soon or lifetimes from now, but even if it is lifetimes from now. The joy of being constantly course corrected, so that I'm not needlessly getting further immersed in samsara. I even agreed with that Muslim Pir when he said, I don't want anything to do with Dr. Syed. But now, I feel the opposite. Being an ajnani is ignorance, and I'm just as ignorant. And so there gets more and more a willingness to associate with the wise, and not caring how silly or stupid I look, if there corrections help to humble me, so that I can be joyous again.n This is enough for now, as I've posted too much lately. However, as I've said, I don't care what and if and when D.G. posts of what I write. It's the writing that I find helpful. If ego overflows out here, what better place.
You know, I have to say, that American football is one of the most complicated and interesting and strategic sports I know of. There are wide receivers to receive passes, running backs to run the ball, the quarterback who throws or passes it to the running back. And tons of plays where people run on different paths. The defensive players, some guard the wide receivers, some try to rush the quarterback. It almost becomes like a chess game. But yeah, usually on offense the quarterback starts off with the ball, either hands it to the running back who tries to run past various defenders or throws to a wide receiver who run long routes, or a tight end that run shorter routes.
My teacher's latest response
Dear Kassy,
Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya
Namaste. Thank you for your several messages.
Certainly, you may feel at ease in writing whatever you wish to
express.
One's ideas about others tend to reflect his ideas of himself. From
that perspective, "observations" are, perhaps, more interpretation than
observation. You may find it helpful to consider this in relation to your
views of the happiness, sadness, etc. of others.
It may also be helpful to examine, in the light of spiritual freedom
or aspiration toward that, how you are using your mind. If repetitive
patterns of thought, such as craving, fear, frustration, etc. plague your
mind, from where is such force or vividness derived, and from where does
this repetitive, undue emphasis come? Is it necessary to continue conjure
confusion?
Spiritual humility is more joyful than assertive arrogance and its
corollary of depressed shame.
The ideas that objects, circumstances, etc. provide happiness and
that the Self or Brahman may be a lonely, desolate state are not based on
actual experience or wisdom. The great rishis, sages, saints, etc. have not
been those who are unhappy or lonely, but, rather, they are truly full of
bliss and are at peace.
Whether or not you should administer medications to your body to
becalm your mind is a question that I cannot answer. I have no experience or
familiarity with such.
There are many aids known since the most ancient times to create,
enhance, and maintain a sattvic state of mind. Have you attempted such and
continue with such?
It is incumbent upon the spiritual seeker to change from his limited
conception to embrace the vast Knowledge of the Self. The attempt to reduce
the Knowledge to fit within the existing conception will not liberate.
Similarly, if one does not understand the meaning of a saying, scriptural
passage, etc., he would do well to seek explanation, reflect and contemplate
such, and deeply meditate so that the meaning becomes clear for him. It may
not be necessary to change the words, and it may prove that the expressions
of the wise, born from silence, contain profound meanings that may be lost
by prematurely replacing the terms with ones that fit in with the existing
conceptions mentioned earlier.
If your opinion is that some aspect of the teaching is pedantic,
that is, obsessed with doctrine and a parading of book-knowledge, such could
appear to be so because of a lack of experience may make the absence of
deviation from Reality seem like a fixed doctrine and, also, not yet
understanding the depth of experience that can be had with spiritual
literature and the reasons for references to such.
The stiffness or rigidity of this body noted by you is a symptom,
one among many, of Parkinson's Disease. By the innate Knowledge of the Self
and by the Grace of Sadguru Ramana, to whom one can never be too thankful,
the body and its states, living or dead, present no bondage. The one Self,
unborn and imperishable, alone exists. That is perfectly full. (Om
purnamadah purnamidam, etc.)
I hope that you find what has been written here helpful. I is to be
understood in the context of the collection of previous messages and not
taken standing alone.
May you ever abide in the happiness and peace of the Self, which is
Brahman, God.
Ever yours in Truth,
Nome
That last response of my teacher's had such a profound impact on me, over the last hour. I had written a bunch of intense e-mails about intense suffering, and frustration with not getting what these teachings mean or are pointing to. phew! he answered it. One thing that was atleast temporarily clear for me, is what within means. I had almost irritatedly said why do they call it within, when they really mean without objects or non-objective. And you see his response in this last letter.(hinted at verbally) Within, is within the guru, it's within the teachings, it's when the focus is totally on the the guru, craving to be liberated, it's not within, the body, it's not within the physical direction. Because the guru, or for me this teacher, is the fire that can completely burn away the world, thoughts, everything, so that that one fire, the guru is the only thing left. The only existent thing, as the Self. The Self, I'm guessing is that raging fire that the guru is. Because temporarily at home not long ago, that fire was burning away all other concerns, including a world. And I was turned toward the fire, which is the guru, because the guru without is the meaning of "within". You are facing within that fire, when facing the guru (and I include reading and wanting to understand things like Talks with Ramana Maharshi in this). Darshan is being licked by it's flames. Normally, my mind is wandering to all sorts of concerns, worries, desires, thoughts, imagination, problems, communicating to others,etc. It is possessed with these. Within, or the guru is the fire that can burn all those away. And realizing the Self (I'm guessing) is when with intensity, my attention is drawn to that fire. Every response of the guru, for instance Maharshi, now I get, increases the desire to be totally obliterated, makes samsara all the more unbearable. When he said, the natural state is without a headache, the devotees headache gets worse, and his desire to realize the state without headaches is increased, his suscepitibility and reilance on the guru, Maharshi increases. (he also gets closer to the fire)In a way maybe the inquiry is also focusing on the guru. Because it's the wanting to get it bad, that causes it to get burned away, and every little touch of that fire, that deeper peace, makes facing any other way but toward the guru, obsession with the teachings, anything else becomes in contrast a mental hell, of suffering and torment and insecurity. At first it may be thinking abou the teachings part of the time, interaction with the guru part of the time. Thinking it is possible to maintain the other stuff. (I'm not talking about physical activity, but mental interest in). But the other stuff increases in it's sorrow, it's unbearableness, the guru becomes more and more a refuge and the desire to get from him the answer greater and greater. This was a temporary insight I thought I'd share. My teacher's saying, "don't feel bad about writing me", your madness, just increase my freedom to turn toward the guru, it's kind of like letting the spring go. The spring wants to be burned, wants the madness to be burned away, and when a jnani gives permission like that, it's like the spring gets let go of. Papaji when he says, "I don't see many people with this fire". It increases the desire of everyone present, even people watching on youtube. What's the reaction in anyone when they hear that, "I'm on fire for it, and because you said that I just want it more."
LMM
A healthy does of Suffering is a Great Treasure for the sincere spiritual practitioner and a curse for the non-practitioner. For the sincere practitioner it has the power to focus and intensify the practice, and throw off the many indulgences that would otherwise stand in our way.
I have had decades of suffering and just recently was reflecting how a consistent healthy dose keeps me from over-indulgence and firmly on the path of practice.
May I continue to have enough suffering so that my practice stays ever on track, . . . . authentic.
* * * * *
There is a wonderful story in a book called, “The Life and Teachings of Sai Baba of Shirdi”, (** note, this is not the contemporary Sai Baba, these are 2 different Baba’s.)
The story tells of Kashinath Govinda Upasani Maharaj, who endured great suffering in the lead up to his realisation. And fortunately, it turns out this book is online at http://books.google.com.au/books, so you can go there, enter the title and read this story for yourself.
Also note, the story is broken up within the chapter, for reasons only understood by the author!
Nevertheless,
the story begins pg 178 at, “On June 27, 1911 . . . . . ”, read through to pg 179, and up to the paragraph beginning, “In bringing to a close …..”
Next go to pg 185, read from “The year 1912 . . . . .”, through to bottom pg 186.
Last, go to pg 192, “Finally, I wish to . . . . . . ” and read to half way down pg 194, where the story ends.
Alternatively, read the entire book, Shirdi Baba was a very interesting person; not to be confused by the current Sathya Sai Baba.
regards
Peter
Friends,
I wish to share this excerpt from the very first chapter of 'At the Feet of Bhagavan' by Sri T K Sundaresa Iyer:
‘A LIFETIME WITH BHAGAVAN’
IN 1908, when I was 12 years old, Bhagavan was still in
Virupaksha Cave. My cousin, Krishnamurthy, used
to go to Bhagavan every day and sing songs of devotion
and worship before him. One day I asked him where he
went daily. He told me: “The Lord of the Hill Himself
is sitting there in human form. Why don’t you come
with me?” I too climbed the hill and found Bhagavan
sitting on a stone slab, with about ten devotees around
him. Each would sing a song. Bhagavan turned to me
and asked, “Well, won’t you sing a song?” One of
Sundaramurthy’s songs came to my mind and I sang it.
It’s meaning was: “No other support I have except Thy
Holy Feet. By holding on to them, I shall win your
grace. Great men sing your praise, Oh Lord. Grant that
my tongue may repeat Thy Name even when my mind
strays.” “Yes, that is what must be done,” said Bhagavan,
and I took it to be his teaching for me. From that time
on I went to him regularly for several years, never missing
a day.
One day I wondered why I was visiting him at all.
What was the use? There seemed to be no inner
advancement. Going up the hill was meaningless toil. I
decided to end my visits on the hill. For one hundred
days exactly I did not see Bhagavan. On the hundred and
first day I could suffer no longer and ran to Skandasramam,
above Virupaksha Cave. Bhagavan saw me climbing, got
up and came forward to meet me. When I fell at his feet,
I could not restrain myself and burst out in tears. I clung
to them and would not get up. Bhagavan pulled me up
and asked: “It is over three months since I saw you. Where
were you?” I told him how I thought that seeing him was
of no use. “All right,” he said, “maybe it is of no use, so
what? You felt the loss, did you not?” Then I understood
that we did not go to him for profit, but because away
from him there was no life for us.
-----------------------------------
It is interesting to connect the above incident with what Maharaj says-
'An Excerpt from 'I am That' where Maharaj says(Page 83):
M: There is nothing wrong with duality as long as it does not create conflict. Multiplicity and variety without strife is joy. In pure consciousness there is light. For warmth, contact is needed. Above the unity of being is the union of love. Love is the meaning and purpose of duality."
This very Truth is beautifully expressed by Sri Ramakrishna in his inimitable way;He says-"I love to eat sugar, I do not want to become sugar."
Namaskar.
Friends,
Deepavali Greetings to you!Wish to share this wonderful excerpt from 'At The Feet of Bhagavan'
Chapter 6. DEEPAVALI DARSAN
BHAGAVAN in His embodied state occupied our
whole heart, being dear to us as father, mother, God
and Guru, all in one. We were loath to leave His presence,
be it night or day. We slept outside the Old Hall, and
Bhagavan was always visible to us on the sofa from where
we were.
On the night prior to Deepavali in 1929, the first
year of my settling in the Ashram, Bhagavan suggested
my going home for the ‘Ganges’ bath (Gangasnanam). To
me (why, to all of us!) the very sight of Bhagavan is a bath
in the Ganga, the sight of Bhagavan is the worship of
Siva, the sight of Bhagavan is the fulfilment of every ritual
and the practice of all austerities. Yet I did not want to go
against the mandate of Bhagavan as I went home, late in
the night. I was impatient to be back with Bhagavan, so
I woke up my wife and children even at 2 a.m., finished
the ceremonial Ganges bath, and hastened to His blessed
Presence.
Bhagavan lay reclining on the sofa. It was about
3-30 a.m.; I made the usual prostration and sat down
by the sofa. All of a sudden an aura was visible around
the head of Bhagavan. It was like the glory with clusters
of evenly arranged flames, just as we see round the
deities in our temple processions. Bhagavan’s face shone
with beaming smiles. It appeared to me that on this
occasion Bhagavan was giving darshan (gracious view)
of Sri Nataraja, the Lord of the Cosmic Dance. In my
ecstasy, I think I must have sung hymns from Thevaram,
which I love as dearly as the Vedas. The vision lasted
for half an hour, and then the glory vanished.(*1) At 4
a.m. Bhagavan sat up for His Pansupari.(*2) I related to
Him what I had seen, and Bhagavan again gave a
beaming smile.
(Foot Note *1: A similar experience is recorded by the Buddhist Lama Anagarika
Govinda in his Foundations of Tibetan Mysticism P.164, quoting the
experience of Baron Dr. Valtheim-Ostaur: ‘While my eyes were immersed
in the golden depths of the Maharshi’s eyes, something happened which
I dare describe only with the greatest reticence and humility in the
shortest and simplest words, according to truth. The dark complexion
of his body transformed itself slowly into white. This white body became
more and more luminous, as if lit up from within, and began to radiate.
I saw him sitting on the tiger-skin as a luminous form. This was no rare
occurrence in the life of devotees; though Bhagavan Himself would
have playfully dismissed it, with all other observed wonders of the senses,
with “It’s all in the mind!”. Yes, that is true, but how many of us can see
such beauties in the mind in place of the ugly and commonplace which
obsess it all the time?
Foot Note *2 -i.e., betel-nut, with a leaf, chunam, and flavourings, taken after
meals as a digestive to be chewed — as customary over most of Southern
Asia.)
-----------------------------------
Spontaneity and simplicity indispensable for any effective sadhana.
Namaskar.
I'm always pulled to put something on here from the Power of the Presence. But since that is David Godman's book. Here is something from A boquet of Nondual Texts by Adi Shankara translated by Dr. H. Ramamoorthy and my spiritual teacher.
1. I am not the body, not the sense or the interior of the body, Not the ego or the group of prana-s, not the intellect.
From wife, husband, place, posessions (or wealth), and such far removed,
The Witness, the Eternal, the Self within, Siva I am.
2. Just as, because of ignorance of the rope, the snake appears in the rope,
Because of one's ignorance of one's own Self, for one-self there is the attitude (concept) of being an individual (jiva);
For[as] by the words of a trusted friend, indeed, that is a rope, upon the destruction of the confusion (cause of error),
By the words of the Guru, I am not the jiva (individual); Siva I am.
3.The unreal universe appears in oneself; Without delusion in the nature of Being-Knowledge-Bliss
That is unreal like delusion, dream, and sleep,
The pure, the perfect, the eternal, the One, Siva I am.
4.I am not born, not grown, [and[ not perished. [These] are said of the body, [and are] all the conditions [properties] of material nature. Doership and such are of that which is full of Conscoiusness, not of the ego, indeed, For truly, of myself, Siva I am.
5.Apart from me, nothing else whatsoever of the universe exists here. True it is that illusion becomes the form (takes the shape) of external objects, Equal to a mirror shining in the mind. In me, in nonduality, it shines (appears); there-fore, Siva I am.
6. Thus of the venerable, glorious, highest renunciate, wandering recluse and great spiritual teacher, Sri Govinda Bhagavan, whose feet are to be worshipped, The disciple, the venerable, glorious Shankara Bhagavan, [by him] composed, The nondual Pentad of Gems (The Five Jewels of Nonduality) concludes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mm9MrHBXZfs&feature=related
This is footage of my spiritual teacher, I'm putting it up because again it impresses with me the power he has for bringing me into a deep experience of egolessness, and the world being an illusion in Bliss. I usually open two windows. One with music. This is the current music I listen to when watching footage of jnanis (people I take to be jnanis)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDFm0rOqgSY
To Ravi, isn't Realizing the Self, tasting the SElf, better then being apart from it, because then that Bliss is the only thing experienced forever? Asking, in all sincerity.
Scott,
"To Ravi, isn't Realizing the Self, tasting the SElf, better then being apart from it, because then that Bliss is the only thing experienced forever? Asking, in all sincerity."
Scott,I understand your query.What Sri Ramakrishna has said(He certainly knew this)is deeper than Logic.
we are essentially dealing with the Paradox of the one becoming the many-Essentially what this means is that the Infinite cannot be limited.Infinite are the ways of experiencing the Infinite.Knowing the Essence of the Infinite is not the same as Knowing the Infinite in its entirety.As Sri Ramakrishna says-Even Suka,The Great one is at the most a Big ant that can carry at the most a Grain or two of sugar ;whereas Brahman is likened to a Huge Mount of Sugar.
This is vastly different than an ignorant person saying the same thing.
More Later.
Namaskar.
.
Dear friends,
divine reality destroys all our holiest insights - that is how I understand this place in Mahabharata. And this is for our best.
"Argument leads to no certain conclusion, the Srutis are different from one another; there is not even one Rishi whose opinion can be accepted by all; the truth about religion and duty is hid in caves: therefore, that alone is the path along which the great have trod."
MAHABHARATA, BOOK 3, VANA PARVA, SECTION CCCXI [Kisari Mohan Ganguli]
.
I understood why people go to jnanis to have their problems solved or desires filled. If I write my teacher about problems that arise for me, I've noticed they tend to go away either internally or externally or both. In general problems I tell my teacher abotu end up beiong solved. Both because i stop worrying about them, but even exteranlly too. It calls on the Self to solve the entirety of the problem.
I was just watching a Papaji satsang video, and I noticed he had a little Om symbol above him. And it made me think of this topic of giving problems to a jnani, and them being solved. I found an Om shirt, a shirt with the Om symbol in my pile of clothing, it is really cool looking. I absolutely have no explanation of where it came from. I never purchased, and no one gave me a shirt with an om symbol. I never saw it before a few days ago. (I think I should probably wear it all the time) I think it is this association with a jnani, and earnestly practicing inquiry manifested an Om shirt.
Friends,
I warmly recommend the Book 'The Quest of the overself' by Dr Paul Brunton.
one of the key part of the Sadhana is how to harness the Emotional aspect in us-the Bhakti approach is precisely to cater to this.Brunton has devoted one whole chapter on this subject;he quotes Ralphs Waldo Emerson-" It seems to be a rule of wisdom never to rely on your memory alone, scarcely even in acts of pure memory, but to bring the past for judgment into the thousand-eyed present, and live ever in a new day. Trust your emotion. In your metaphysics you have denied personality to the Deity, yet when the devout motions of the soul come, yield to them heart and life, though they should clothe God with shape and color. Leave your theory, as Joseph his coat in the hands of the harlot, and flee."
Namaskar.
A quote that I haven't seen anyone else quote but I think it is just almost like a great aphorism in response to someone asking why there are bad people in the world, and how to be happy when there is so much evil? He flippantly responded in Talks with Ramana. Ramana said and I wrote it on this little plastic drawer I have in my apartment. (maybe not flippantly, but assuredly and probably with much humility)
"All are gurus to us. The wicked by their evil deeds say 'do not come near me'. The good are always good. Therefore all are like gurus to us".
Throughout Talks he'll say things that are like canonical gospel worthy, but these are quotes that almost should be mined for. In another part he didn't let the person get semantical and said,
"What you call nature, others call God".
I mean just not letting people get caught up on trivial details, or to worry about others. Which is all the ego does, is worry about others, and semantics.
I've thought about the "mind what you have come for". And alot of these things at first seem like, my reaction is, oh the insincere devotee gets caught up in the politics of the ashram, what an idiot! And Robert Adams was smart enough not to. Well, Robert Adams was a jnani, he had no problem with minding why he had came. But around a presence like Ramana Maharshi who is Brahman, Siva, the Self, and only that. And radiating that experience constantly. Us, with our minds active constantly, it would be I imagine very difficult to not get caught up in other matters. Because "minding why I came", would be easy like "Abiding in the Self". Which is why Ramana said it, because he was guru-ing, and the contrast of the affairs of the ashram, and his steady guidance, it was to abide in his presence and not the affairs of the mind, which the ashram affairs/politics represented. I see that alot in myself, where getting sidetracked from the essential goal. Infact if I didn't have this teacher to correspond with interact with, who keeps my focus steady, and makes it clear why it is important in all matters, I would get caught up in other things, and think I was still practicing Inquiry. When the inquiry doesn't seem to really admit of anything else, it's a total focus on the divine to the exclusion of all else. Atleast in importance. And I think that is what "mind what you have come" was referring to, was instruction to keep the attention focused on the divine, Ramana, and not the affairs of the mundane mind getting obsessed with worldly matters, it was almost like ashram politics were a prop for that instruction. I would imagine alot of devotees would get caught up, but Ramana's kind and constant reminders kept their focus more directly on the inquiry, on Ramana.
It seems like a jnani like Ramana, and inquiry are synonomous. Focus on the guru, and inquiry are the same in the same manner that bhakti and inquiry are really the same.
Dear all,
Today is Diwali. It commemorates Lord Krishna slaying the demon Naraka.
When asked to explain Deepavali’s significance, Bhagavan offered the following verse:
He who seeks whence is Naraka,
Who this hell-like world is ruling,
Mistaking the filthy body
For the Self, and after kills him
By the means of Wisdom’s Wheel,
Is Narayana. And that day
When he does it, is auspicious,
Called Naraka-Chaturdasi.
Know Deepavali is shining
As the real Self, having sought for
Naraka, the mighty sinner,
That one who deteriorated
Taking for the Self the mansion
Of this hell-like, guileful body,
Having sought him and then slain him.
It is said that, like Vijayadasami, if any undertaking is commenced today, it is sure to succeed. Let us all take the above words of Bhagavan as a fresh initiation in the Path.
Regards Murali
"All are gurus to us. The wicked by their evil deeds say 'do not come near me'. The good are always good. Therefore all are like gurus to us".
That is one of the Maharshi quotes, I saw it in Talks, but I don't believe I've ever seen anyone quote it. It is succinct instruction not to focus on what others are doing. The good are always directing us to come to them, the bad are always directing us to get away from them. It kind of seems in keeping with "keep holy company", or "association with the wise", that those who behave badly drive us away, while those who behave maturely, or even sagely draw us toward them.
It becomes clear that this is hte highest teaching there is, and if pursued dilligently with an open mind to understand it, will liberate one from everything, and attain the highest happiness, the most wellbeing, the greatest compassion, the most loving relationship to everything and everyone. Now maybe ultimately there is no everything and everyone, but I'm not quite at that point yet.I would say so far it seems the best possible asset has been not thinking I understand it, but letting the meaning unfold for me. It was like in my teacher's last letter, the words perhaps don't need to be replaced because they contain profound, deeper, subtler meanings. I wouldn't be able to appraoch those meanings if I thought my initial understanding was valid. For instance, within, I questioned why is it called within, when there is no within. But it occured to me, that within is within the Divine Self, which is not localized within the body, it is attention focused on what is holy, divine, the guru, the Self, that is the real within. Or so it seemed. I'm sure for other words that is similar. Alot of terms I'm not sure why they are used in that way. But it seems this constant earnest effort to understand, is maybe the most beneficial task a human being could understand, because these teachings have the potential to burn away all problems, all suffering, all mental garbage, all ego, all non-divine.
So that, maybe, Gnana fire will be born, as Lakshmana swami said, and sticking mind will get burnt.
Happy Deepavali to all and may Bhagavan destroy the Narakasura in us - the feeling 'I am the body'.
"It is said that, like Vijayadasami, if any undertaking is commenced today, it is sure to succeed. Let us all take the above words of Bhagavan as a fresh initiation in the Path."
thank you Murali
was reflecting today that i must continue to reinvigorate my practice in order to keep it fresh . . . . it is the most important thing, but how to stay on-track always??; perhaps today is the day, after your post, . . . . to never again stray, not even a wisker, from the practice
regards
Peter
Friends,
The significance of Deepavali!one may say that anything to do with Lights may have a similiar significance- when Muruganar asked Sri Bhagavan about the significance of the Karthikai Deepam festival, he composed a stanza of four lines in which he says, “The true significance of the Karthikai Deepam festival is that it turns the intellect inwards and having fixed it in the Heart merges it with the indweller of the Heart"
I wish to share this excerpt from 'Letters from Ramanasramam' that reveals the accessibility of Sri Bhagavan,as a Friend and playmate.
207.Playing with the children.
"Another devotee enquired if it were a fact that Bhagavan and Nayana used to swim in the Pandava
Tank. Bhagavan replied, “Yes. That also was only in those days. We used to try to excel each other in
swimming. That was great fun.”
Another devotee said, “It seems you played marbles with children?”
Bhagavan replied, “Yes. That was so. That too was while we were in the Virupaksha Cave. The holes
dug for the purpose of playing marbles must be there even now. Those children sometimes used to
bring packets of sweets. We all shared them. During Dipavali they used to put aside my share of
crackers and bring them up to me. We used to fire the crackers together. It was most entertaining.” I
was reminded of the leelas (playful acts) of Lord Krishna’s boyhood days. Even now Bhagavan plays
with children if they come here with toys.
-----------------------------------
Sri Muruganar wanted to compose those verses expressing the 'true significance'(for Muruganar!)and asked Sri Bhagavan, who in response composed those verses.
The children approached Sri Bhagavan as children and Sri Bhagavan became a child freaking out with them!
As for me,I prefer to take sides with the children.
Namaskar.
Here is full sequence of Deepavali verses from Guru Vachaka Kovai. The numbered ones were composed by Muruganar:
181 They say that Lord Narayana killed the demon Naraka. But really Naraka is the ego that parades itself by taking the hellish body to be ‘I’. Hence, those who enquire into the source of this Naraka and destroy him are indeed Narayana, the killer of Naraka.
Editor's note: ‘Naraka’ is both the term for the hell realm and the name of the asura who was slain by Krishna, the avatar of Lord Narayana. In South India the festival of Deepavali celebrates the victory of Narayana over Naraka. One of the key events of this celebration is a ritual bath that is taken at an auspicious time. This is referred to in the next verse.
182 Taken on Naraka Chaturdasi, the auspicious bath that symbolises the conquest of Naraka is actually bathing in the waters of true knowledge after killing Naraka, the ego, by tracking him down to his place of residence.
Bhagavan 4 Naraka is he who rules the world of Hell by taking the hellish body to be ‘I’. Hence, he who slays Naraka with the discus of jnana by enquiring ‘From where does this Naraka arise?’ is Lord Narayana Himself. That day indeed is the auspicious Naraka Chaturdasi day.
183 Know clearly that Naraka is the one who is condemned to ruin through taking as ‘I’ the foul mass of flesh, the hell that is the body, whilst Deepavali is the eternal radiance of the Supreme Self that shines after Naraka, the reflection, has been destroyed following the enquiry into his nature.
Bhagavan 5 Clearly know that [the auspicious day of] Deepavali denotes shining as the Self by seeking and destroying the great sinner Naraka, who ruined himself by regarding as ‘I’ the prison of the body, the source of misery that truly is Hell.
I had a couple what might have been samadhi experiences. What happened is while feeling blissful, I just decided to rest with that, no further practice, just rest in it, suddenly everything came to a standstill, but my concentration became really intense on one-point of vision. And it kind of expanded. I was zoning out externally, but internally, my concentration was razor-sharp. It was just absolutely still, I was aware of everything. I was really thinking lately about the difference perhaps between Maharshi's zoning out, bliss, and catatonia. And I was thinking that perhaps in samadhi, the 'person' in samadhi is aware of everything going on around them, where as the catatonic person is cut off. Even though the person in samadhi might seem to be in a trance or not responding to the environment. Catatonia is maybe perhaps intense egoity, although it may be a reaction to deeper experience. I've wondered if some 'madness' is started by a nirvikalpa samadhi experience, and then a rejection of that experience. In my early 20s I suspect that might be what happened, that caused me to be in such intense 'trippy' anxiety for a long time. It was a nirvikalpa samadhi experience, or falling into the Self, followed by an intense rejection of that experience because I was no where near ready as David Godman already pointed out. Although I think that may have been the the precursor to being exposed to Ramana Maharshi and his teachings. When I was at SAT temple, everyone there radiated a certain something that I would imagine they all including devotees spent alot of time in samadhi, but don't even consider that, or get to consider it ordinary. There was this really ordinary guy, I really liked him, and he was lighting incense around the temple, and chanting "Om namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya", and there was a peace about him, and it seemed in some weird way like he wasn't the doer. Hard to explain. And the more time spent in samadhi, the more harmonious the actions become, the more beautiful the creations. It reminds me of ribhu Gita Ch.26. "Ever abide in Bliss, without a trace of a concept (sankalpa). In that itself, as that itself". That was my experience in these state recently. But the interesting thing is that concentration was not relaxed it was really razor-sharp and intense, and maybe that is what is meant by one-pointed. It's in the absence of attachment, the concentration normally grasping at things, suddenly comes to rest in a one-pointed state, but not with volition. It's really intense, and maybe that is why jnanis respond so correctly to things, because there concentration is perfectly one-pointed on the task at hand, with not an iota of distraction. It was effortless at times, but the concentration as if great effort. sorry to brag (laugh). Surest way to leave it. (laugh)
This statement by my teacher already posted seems to be along the lines of my experience. But even have further clarity.
"Concentration is a mode of mind that derives its intensity from the
luminous Self, yet is placed within the context of thought or mental
attention. The concentration may be external, that is upon some object or
the breath, or internal, upon some mental conception or mental image, such
being of a spiritual character. The value of such lies in the abeyance of
other thoughts, though temporary, and the faith in the spiritual ideal
contemplated. Dharana (concentration) is not an end in itself, and the yogis
say that one should proceed to dhyana (meditation). Such should involve the
dissolution of the mind or the transcendence of thought. This, also, is not
the end, but one should then enter into samadhi, your questions about which
were answered previously. The highest and nonobjective form of meditation is
Atma-vicara (Self-inquiry), which reveals sahaja samadhi or sahaja sthiti,
absorption or steady abidance in the Innate as the Innate, which is
Self-Knowledge. Such inquiry and Knowledge are jnana. The inquiry, thus, is
not a mere shift of attention, or the repetition of a mental mode, but a
profound questioning of your very identity to inwardly discern your Being as
it truly is. Such inquiry is inherently mind-transcendent."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuiAW_6XKVM&feature=channel
I still have this strong suspicion that Barack Obama is a jnani, a jivanmukta. he's not helping cure me of this.
If Obama is a Jnani; he certainly didn't have the courage to meet the Dalai Lama! The Nobal prize given to Obama is obviously worthless as he has done absolutely
nothing for world peace!
Cool. I'll shut up now, as I have no intention of proving anything to anyone.
You could be right, I have no idea what is true.
I am writing some explanatory notes to one of Janansambandhar's Tevaram verses. In one place he writes: 'He [Siva] is the slayer of the demon who masqueraded as a fruiting wood-apple tree.'
I have half a memory that this is a story from the Bhagavatam. Is my memory correct? Does anyone know what this story is, and where it comes from?
Well, actually the reasons for my suspicion with Obama, and I'm sorry if talking about a charged political figure as possibly a jnani is inappropriate, this is just in response to anonymous. They say, and I remember Lakshmana swami saying that you cannot tell a jnani unless you are one. That makes sense. And probably true, and as I am not Realized. Though certain people seem to radiate the same dispassion, and equanimity, ssemingly sattvic no matter how deep i get, where others don't seem to. And it is totally irrelevent to my inquiry, to Realization who is and who isn't a jnani, unless they are my guru, or Maharshi. But the examples brought forth by you, really don't mean much to me, in terms of this, because prizes are prizes, and as maharshi said, you can't tell a jnani by their actions. My guess of why, is because they abide in a state beyond the mind, and so their actions are ungraspable with the mind. I do notice something like this with Obama, that his responses seem to transcend ideology. Infact the example of not meeting with the dalai lama is for me case and point. And I even have my own explanation of why. I've noticed I think, that it seems the enlightened respond only to what people are ready to hear. For instance, Maharshi did not prevent people from doing things, he said he did not approve of, because it would be futile. In a similar way, (laugh), Obama's not meeting with the Dalai Lama (which I don't know much about), might fit with that, in that certain parties, and countries and people were not ready for the U.S. to validate Tibet's obvious claims to sovereignty. Domestically, I've noticed similar tact. But I wonder if that tact is the reason I'm mentioning that a jnani would only respond when someone is ready to hear it, because that is the only time that person is actually calling on the Self for a response from the jnani. infact my teacher often does not respond to the things I think I could most benefit from a response on, but other things that always surprise me, because they are not the main things I'm thinking about, but are the things where I really am ready to change, and am calling upon the Self to provide the correct answers. Another U.S. president that I've suspected of being enlightened is Abraham Lincoln, and similarly he was vehemently anti-slavery in his Lincoln-Douglas debates, but as President was initially moderate with the pro-slavery South. And infact when he uttered his Emancipation Proclamation to end slavery, it only pertained to rebel states, not union states. Why? Because that was what the North was ready for, to continue fighting for. If it was punishment for the South. But that was maybe the correct, well-timed action in terms of actually ending slavery, whereas if he had of said, morally I'm opposed, and slavery should be ended even in the Union states, it may have ended Northern support for the war. And as of 2007, african americans might still be slaves.
Actually in this book I read, Lincoln's relationship with his cabinet reminded me of the sat-guru devotee relationships mentioned in the Power of the Presence. His addresses, Gettysburg, inauguration are still considered almost like religious texts as part of the U.S's mythology because they invoke something kind of profound spiritually. Another, potential I think Jnani emperor/leader of a country, was Marcus Aurelius who even said that ehre is only One Self. He was a Roman Emperor, and even during his reign there was still (I think) persecution of Christians, but his sayings are so replete with wisdom, and as I said, he made some very strong Advaita (nondual) statements about the One Self that is completely nondual. I have noticed that Obama's statements about religion are very mature and in keeping with some of the stuff Maharshi says. For instance when asked about Christianity. And actually as to the Nobel Prize being deserved. It does occur to me that his Cairo speech, his respect for Islamic tradition, seems to be really unprecedented and a sight for sore eyes so to speak compared to the previous president, and that in itself, I wonder if warrants the Nobel Peace Prize? But I should also add, I am non-partisan, have no interest in politics, do not support Obama for political reasons, am not a Democrat. for the reasons above elucidated or why I am interested.
I searched the internet but all I could find were web pages which talk about Krishna as the slayer of a demon who masqueraded as a fruiting wood-apple tree:
http://www.ramanuja.org/sv/bhakti/archives/jan96/0100.html
Tiruppavai HYMN 24
Did you not use the demon Vatsaasura who came in
the guise of a calf, as a missile, to destroy demon
Kapiththaasura as well, who had taken the form of a wood-apple
tree? Glory to you, the matchless Lord!
David,
Please refer to Srimad Bhagavatham, canto 10,chapter 11,verses 41 through 43 :
Text 41
One day at the bank of the Yamunâ tending their calves with their playmates arrived there a demon [Vatsâsura] with the intent to kill Krishna and Balarâma.
Some day at the bank of the Yamunâ tending their calves with their playmates arrived there a demon [Vatsâsura] with the intent to kill Krishna and Balarâma. (Vedabase)
Text 42
Noticing him who, assuming the form of a calf, had mixed with the other calves, pointed the Lord at him gesturing to Baladeva, meanwhile inconspicuously slowly getting close to him.
Noticing him who assuming the form of a calf had mixed with the other calves, pointed the Lord him out gesturing to Baladeva, meanwhile inconspicuously slowly getting near him. (Vedabase)
Text 43
Catching him by the hind legs along with his tail whirled Acyuta him heavily around and threw He him lifeless on top of a kapittha tree [**] where the body of the demon assumed a giant size and, dead, together with the tree fell to the ground.
The Kapitha tree (wood apple tree )alone is mentioned and no Demon is associated with this tree.
Please refer to:
http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org/canto10/chapter11.html
-----------------------------------
Andal's Tiruppavai verse 24 also refers only to vatsasura and not to Kapiththasura-this seems to be a later 'value addition' !
-----------------------------------
Interestingly,Lord Siva is good at giving boons to Asuras and it is the job of Lord Narayana to resolve the problems!
Namaskar.
David,
Looks like Gnanasambandar has only said (in verse 105)
The Oceanic Blue hued one(Lord Krishna)who flung (the Demon Vatsasura who took on the appearance of a calf and mingled with the other calves tended by the cowherd friends of gopala)to hit the Bilva Fruit;etc,etc.
There is no explicit mention of a Demon masquerading as Vilva Fruiting Tree(This is Highly unlikely in as much the Wood apple Tree is a Sacred one ,very dear to Siva).
Namaskar.
Thanks Ravi and Anonymous. I had been working with an inaccurate translation of this verse. I have now sorted out both the original syntax and the stories associated with it.
Friends,
I wish to share this excerpt from 'Letters from Ramanasramam':
28th May, 1946
(47) WHICH IS THE VEHICLE?
Our brother’s children, Swarna and Vidya, wanted to
see Adi Annamalai Temple, Durgamba Temple and others
and so we set out yesterday morning after obtaining
Bhagavan’s permission. As the summer had already set in, I
was afraid these young children of ten and twelve years might
not be able to walk in the hot sun and so engaged a bullock
cart. the cart, other children of the same age and even
younger ones, also started out with us. We went round the
hill by way of pradakshina, saw all the places of interest and
returned by about 11-30. As we came into the hall at 3 p.m.,
Bhagavan enquired of me, “At what time did you come back?”
When I said it was 11-30 a.m., Bhagavan asked, “Were these
children able to walk the distance?” I told him we went round
in a bullock cart. Bhagavan jocularly said, “Oh, I see. You
went in a cart. Who gets the punya (religious merit), the cart
or the bullock or these children?” I could not give a reply.
Bhagavan said: “This body itself is a cart. Another cart for
this cart! A bullock to pull this cart! For a work done like this
(going round the hill), people say, ‘We have done it.’
Everything is like that. People come by train from Madras
and say, ‘We have come’. It is the same thing with the body.
For the self, the body is a cart. The legs do the work of
walking and people say, ‘I walked, I came.’ Where does the
Self go? The Self does not do anything but appropriates to
itself all these acts.” So saying, he enquired, “Did they walk
at least some distance?” I said that they walked up to Gautama
Ashram, doing bhajan, but could not walk further because of
the hot sun. “That is something. They walked at least some
distance,” said Bhagavan.
You know, Vidya is a mischievous child. Ever since she
came she has been asking a lot of questions about Bhagavan.
“Won’t Bhagavan Thatha (grandfather) come anywhere? Why
not?” Not satisfied with my replies, on the 24th she herself
asked Bhagavan why he did not go anywhere. As you are
aware, Bhagavan is very pleased with the words of little
children. Looking at her affectionately, he said, “You want
to take me to your place? That is your idea, isn’t it? That is
all very well but if I go anywhere, all these people will also
come with me and on the way, ever so many people will
invite me to their places. If I don’t go, will they agree to
that? No. They will take me there bodily. From there, some
more people will start. Can you take them all with you? Not
only these people. If I move out, the whole of Arunachala
itself may start. How can you take it away? See, I have been
kept in this jail. Even if you take me away, someone will
catch me on the way and again put me in some other jail.
What can I do? How can I come, tell me? Will all these people
let me go? What do you say?” Vidya could not reply. From
that time onwards, he used to tell people, “This child is
inviting me to her place.”
Yesterday, having heard that the two children were
leaving for their native place that day, and seeing Vidya
standing near the doorway, Bhagavan, while going out at
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 81
9-45 a.m., caught hold of her hand and said, “Child! Will
you take me also with you? Tie me up firmly, put me in a
cart and take me away.” Before leaving, Vidya took
Bhagavan’s photos to him and showed them. As soon as he
saw the photos, Bhagavan said, “So you are taking me away.
Tie me firmly and throw me in the cart.” Every one present
felt happy, and Vidya in her great joy, frolicking, began
saying, “Yes, I am taking away Bhagavan Thathayya.”
-----------------------------------
How Sri Bhagavan acknowledges the merit of circumambulation of Arunachala-"That is something. They walked at least some
distance".
I have often observed that this walking around the Hill-just the mechanics/kinetics is the Equivalent of 'Asana and Pranayama' of Yoga.After walking a while,the Breath falls into a sort of Rhythm.
Namaskar.
It seems like gradually the bad tendencies fall away. There was an interesting comment by my teacher that I've now suddenly understood in maybe deeper significance. These two different replies seem to go together, like retroactive instructions. He gives them, and it almost is like it kicks in like a worm (good one), that is introduced into my programming, until it unfolds, so maybe a butterfly larvae would be a more wholesome analogy. This was the 2nd reply I got from him, and the 2nd paragraph filled me with immense billowing clouds of Bliss immediately.
Dear Kassy Hiroshima,
Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya
Namaste. Thank you for your response message.
Turning within, you will find that you actually know more than you think. In how many ways do you seek for happiness, such as by the approval mentioned by you? It is an intuition of your natural state and an unknowing search for yourself.
As love is far more fulfilling than any amount of approval, and as true Knowledge is infinitely deeper than any kind of thinking, your true Self is far more expansive and substantial than the ego notion and it attendant tendencies that form the illusory personality.
Trust in Sri Bhagavan, follow his teaching, and, with his Grace, dive within. Thus you will be happy at heart.
May your earnest inquiry be deep so that your real nature of Being-Consciousness-Bliss is revealed within you.
Ever yours in Truth,
Nome
This was the following response
Dear Kassy,
Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya
Namaste. If you determine within yourself the real source of happiness, the results will be very far-reaching. You will thus find deep, unwavering peace, nonattachment toward all objects and situations, and the bliss of abidance at the very source of wisdom and love.
If guilty about past actions, be sure that you abide in a state in which those actions cannot recur and the very definitions of the personality that were the cause of such errors have been destroyed.
It is axiomatic that you should act (with body, speech, and mind) toward others as you would wish them to do toward you. Just steadfastly observing this much yields significant depth and lightness of heart. With inquiry, you come to realize others as the Self.
With faith in Bhagavan and his teachings, earnestly practice the best that you are able. Grace is ever present, and its joyful fullness is found by those who, hearts full of love, spiritually practice in this way.
Ever yours in Truth,
Nome
The paragraph about doing unto others, not just with body and speech but with mind as well. But how could you do unto others with mind as well, without abiding in the Bliss of the Self, without the restful contentedness of abiding not as an ego, but resting in pure Blissful Being, how else could I do unto others with my mind? I don't think I can. So the only way to fulfill this, his second instruction to me, is by actually Realizing the Self. Otherwise, I could do unto others with just body and speech. Not murder or rape people, or lie or steal. I could do that, while still thinking about killing people, still fantasizing in a non-consensual way about women (or whoever someone is attracted to), still desire what someone else has, and want to steal it. But i could obey in a stringent, follow the rules kind of way, codified norms, and not break the rules. And then perhaps feel self-righteous for having won the battle with my body and speech, and being better than others (those who haven't)--and even then I'm acting in a way lacking in compassion toward those struggling with their vasanas. All of which I have done. But what if there is a deeper level? To actually abide in a state where there isn't even the desire to do those things, mind as well. And what would that be but a purified mind, a sattvic mind, which I remember in Essence of Enquiry the commentary my teacher did on Maharshi's first recorded teachings, does not have a form, is a formless mind, which is sattvic, pure. Abiding in the pure, Supreme Bliss of the Self. I'm laughing, because that is the only way to fulfill this instruction. Anyone who is not Self-Realized doesn't and cannot do unto others truly, from that standpoint. I'm finding that his first instructions were the most comprehensive, his more recent instructions are auxilary to get me to realize the first instructions. I didn't see how important those first instructions were, that they were infact the fundamentals of Self-inquiry and Self-Realization. Anyone who wants to practice Self-inquiry cannot while on the other hand thinking bad thoughts, "oh I want to beat up, or yell at that person, what an idiot!", "I want to have sex with that woman---with no regard to her wishes in the matter", "I wish I was rich, i hate being poor. Rich people are all greedy", "Those people are dumb". It's not that someone who thinks like this can't practice inquiry, but that those things have to be dealt with by the inquiry, the surrender, the worship, the devotion. The mind has to be purified. And I still think negative thoughts sometimes, but there gets to be more the Blissful, selfless, happy tendency that is stronger and stronger. I got the human birth, I got the spiritual teacher, I got the guru, I might as well actualy practice and Realize. It seems like an important instruction, because not only is it vital, but doing unto others with all 3 body, and speech and mind even the attempt at doing so, woudl take one a long way toward Self-Realization, I think. And ultimately if one could do that perfectly, Self-REalization would be done.
Saw a wonderful, intense DVD of Abhishiktananda. The struggle twixt
his Christian background and Advaita was sincere and profound.
Ultimately I was just exhausted by the stuggle he went through. Even a man like Abhishiktananda, so ready and ripe and still that mammoth tussle to be it, fully understand and be the self.
Which is weird beause I don't relaly see the conflict or that christianity and advaita are really different in essence. It seems like only the superficial differentiates them. Often Maharshi actually sounds like Jesus throughout Talks with Ramana Maharshi. And often Jesus sounds like Maharshi in the New Testement. Which is maybe to be expected considering they were both abiding as the same Self. As I was saying below, the famous maxim of Jesus "do unto others..." the so called Golden Rule. Which probably predates and is more universal, doesn't seem like it can really be fully practiced unless there isn't the differentiation of self and other, and there is Blissful contentment that doesn't allow for selfish tendencies. So... what difference? Or any other religion? Or even secular humanism for that matter? Or even the karma yoga of atheist activists? What difference? Also there is advaita the concept, which doesn't really have alot of relevance to the actual nondual state of Realizatoin. I could say I'm an advaitin and still take myself as an individual and be invested in that. So what significance does it have? So the conflict seems like it could only be on the level of illusion. And Maharshi was so gut at cutting down those kinds of illusions.
Regarding Abishiktananda and his interior journey.He was a Benedictine monk and I suppose had
a lot of Christian conditioning he had to cast off before he could enter the non dual path.
Christianity in the past has been quite 'sly' in its efforts to infiltrate Hinduism.
Neverthless Abishiktananda's efforts seemed to me to be totally true and sincere.
Anonymous/Friends,
I am interested in that DVD on Abhisiktananda.What is the Title of this DVD and where to get it?
Abhisiktananda is indeed a great soul and a true adventurer.
I came across this article that captures the essence of what anonymous has referred to-Pl refer:
http://www.hermitary.com/solitude/abhishiktananada.html
This 'paradox' and 'dilemma' that Abhisiktananda was battling is already reconciled in Sanatana Dharma which recognises that the personal and impersonal are facets of the one immutable Reality.(The Life of Sri Ramakrishna exemplified this Truth)
I understand that Abhisiktananda took Sanyasa(in a formal way)from Swami Chidananda of Divine Life Society and spent his last years in North India,(surviving a Heart Attack).
The simple Logic behind Abhisiktananda's approach is this-If one can be a devotee of Siva or Sakthi or Ganapathy or Muruga or Vishnu or Sun God(The Shanmadha or Six Religions of Hindu Philosophy established by Sri Sankaracharya)-Why not include Jesus,the Christ and Christianity as a Way culminating in Advaitic Experience.If one can be a devotee of Lord Krishna and also be an Advaitin,one can be a devotee of Jesus and attain to Advaitic Experience.
This is what Sri Ramakrishna's Life Exemplified-He did Practice Christianity(in its exclusive way) and Islam(when he did not visit even the Kali Temple!Typically like an orthodox Muslim).This aspect of Sri Ramakrishna's Sadhana is Truly Revealing of this Great Truth-If one can put one's Heart and Soul ,whatever be one's IDEAS OR CONCEPTIONS or DOGMAS-one can still attain to the Ultimate Truth.Ultimately it is God that meets man more than Half way or to put it in another way it is God Realizing that he is God!This is the paradox of Life (and hence Death!)and the beauty and wonder that it is!(Not withstanding our dismissal of it as a 'Dream' ,as 'unreal' as a Creation of 'mind',etc).
Namaskar.
Dear All,
The following extract from a satsang of Robert Adams hit me forcibly. He always has a very straight and forceful style...
"Surrender everything, your problems, your ego, your body, your mind, your work, your world.
Say, ‘Here, God, take it, I want no more of this. I am yours. Do with me as you will. Thy will be done.’
This means you no longer have anything to worry about. If you truly surrender, you will immediately become radiantly happy, for you have given your ego to God. And what’s left is God. You have no body. You have no mind. You have no work. You have no problems. It has been your ego all the time fooling you, making you believe that something is wrong, and you’ve been playing hide and seek, trying to find God here, there and everywhere, when all the time God was within yourself as yourself.
Begin to see the truth. Begin to stand up tall. Become fearless. Become strong. Leave the world alone. It’ll take care of itself. There is a mysterious power that guides the world to its right destiny. It doesn’t need any help from you. If you’re meant to do certain work in the world, it will be done, but you have nothing to do with that. It doesn’t mean that you have to leave your job, or go sit in a cave, or give up your life. Wherever you are, right now is where you’re supposed to be. Just feel, ‘I am not the doer’ and your work will go on. Do not be attached to your work. Do not react to any situation or any condition. Be yourself. Focus your attention on consciousness, and your body will go on doing whatever it came here to do. Everything is preordained. Even when I raise my finger like this, it is preordained. Do not be egotistical and believe that you have any power over everybody or anybody, or that you are the doer. It’s a privilege to have been born on this earth, and the reason you have been born is to find your real Self. Go for it, do it, and become free"
.
... Robert Adams ...
One of the strongest sayings I know stems from him (I try to translate it):
"The one being the greatest in martial art is the one doing nothing whatsoever. He not even needs to defend himself. He goes another way - he accepts to be killed."
Another is from Poonjaji:
(On the question of founding spiritual communities:)
"Let the thieves live together and let the few really free people spread all over the world."
.
What murali said, was what I was thinking about on the way to this computer lab. How my approach to having a correspondence with a sat-guru started off asking inquiry questions, but really became laying my delusions, and problems before him, so that his sword of discrimination could cut them down.
(which he does so skillfully), and infact since I've done taht his responses have been so much more effective. So the inquirer is the guru. My attempts at inquiry or spiritual discrimination are feeble and unsuccessful. I can know something is a delusion deep down, but can't seem to stop conjuring it, until I get a response from the sat-guru, whose discrimination is unfailing. It often hurts initially, but then i feel a great peace.
It made me realy think of dialogues with Maharshi, and how it seems the devotee's approach is to feebly attempt spiritual discrimination (the inquiry), but the real discrimination are Maharshi's responses that are the Self responding perfectly to whatever the delusion is on the part of the devotee. (and all devotees are delusional) I remember Robert Adams saying in Silence of teh Heart satsang transcripts that (paraphrasing), "you realize you are nothing, and I know that is going to hurt some of you".
In a sense maybe it's that the point of individual practice is to realize that the individual is powerless to practice, and so the reliance on teh guru, God, the Supreme, what have you, becomes greater and greater. Until as Murali quoted Robert Adams, it is all completely forfeited.
I mean, I just know throughout all my attempts that I am powerless to conquer anger, lust, sadness, indolence (laziness) on my own. I would go so far as to say it is an impossibility. But when I lay it before the sat-guru, and get a response with unfailing discrimination, there is the Knowledge in the form of great peace that is unveiled, and more clarity as to how I'm falling out of pristine states for a bunch of madness and repetative thought.
But even then, the best solution I've found is writing the sat-guru about exactly the kinds of worry and agitation (no matter how insane or embarressing) I am suffering. Immediately, no matter how big seeming the problem, and sometimes they get bigger as if the whole universe is conspiring to make me give up, immediately after writing him, a weight is lifted, and it's almost as if it was never a problem.
Everything in spiritual practice seems to engender greater reliance on the guru, and less reliance on the ego, it seems like an unavoidable process. And the guru's responses are always hurtful to the ego. (though temporarily) Then it is realized how much free-er it is without the delusion.
This was an older letter from my teacher.
Dear Kassy,
Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya
Namaste. Thank you for your recent messages.
Peace is of the very nature of the immutable Self. Misidentification
appears to disturb it or veil it. Self-Knowledge, revealed by Self-inquiry
destroys the misidentifications, which are only ignorance and not true.
Repression does not succeed in the destruction of ignorance. It is
like holding a piece of wood under the surface of water. As soon as the hold
is released, the wood bobs to the surface again. Likewise is it with the
suppression of thoughts, inclusive of those that you refer to as emotions.
Without true Knowledge, they reappear. Of course, indulgence in the delusion
is also unsuccessful and represents no true freedom. Sri Bhagavan says that
such is like pouring kerosene on a fire in the attempt to extinguish it.
Neither side of the dualism can substitute for actual inquiry to know
oneself.
The intensity in any bondage or suffering derives from you. Turn
that into the intensity for Liberation, and, applying it to fervent, keen
inquiry, you will pass beyond all suffering and bondage. If you discern the
causes of the suffering, which are invariably one's own misidentifications
and attachments, you can abolish it in the blissful realization of who you
really are.
Cessation of thinking is not the same as Knowledge of the Self, or
Self-Realization, though in the latter the nonexistence of thought is
self-evident. Thoughts may stop in deep sleep, in some anesthetized states,
etc., but such does not result in Self-Realization. Self-Realization
transcends every state and mode of mind.
Health and sickness pertain to the body. They are unrelated to the
Self and to spiritual practice.
If you suffer from loneliness in any form, the answer lies within.
All are only in the Self. The Self is never lonely, though it exists without
another. Practice so as to completely dissolve the misidentifications and
their concomitant differentiation, and thereby your joy will be full and
unending. Self-inquiry is the practice. Surrender on a path of deep bhakti
(devotion) can bring the same result as the path of jnana (Knowledge)
because of its dissolution of the ego, attachments, and such.
The tradition of Vedanta describes practice in terms of sravana
(listening), manana (reflection) and nididhyasana (profound meditation).
Listening, or receiving spiritual instruction, usually occurs in satsang. In
addition, the reading of appropriate books can assist in this. In the
present time, it seems, CDs and DVDs can also assist, as described by you.
The general advice is that the seeker should do all that is possible to
support the essential introspection, making the first two continual and the
third continuous.
I hope that you find the above helpful and that you find the
imperishable bliss within you.
Ever yours in Truth,
Nome
Here is another one, the first line is about sexuality.
Dear Kassy,
Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya
Namaste. Thank you for your messages.
A pleasant sensation minus the happiness essence associated with it
is meaningless for all. The happiness is what all desire. The Self is this
happiness.
Pain represents no suffering for those who know the Self to be
bodiless.
It is in the very nature of bodies to move toward what is
pleasurable for them (e.g., food when hungry, rest when exhausted, absence
of pain) and to move away from what is painful (e.g., alleviation of pain,
treatment of wounds and sickness, etc.) Such, in itself, is not bondage. He
who misidentifies with the body suffers in the bondage of the cycle of
pleasures and pains, and births and deaths. He who knows himself as the Self
abides liberated from all that and is ever happy and at peace. The same
holds true for being in the company of another or not.
The reference to pranayama (affecting the animating life energy by
regulation of the breath) by the Maharshi is an allusion to what Adi Sankara
explains in his Aparoksanubhuti ("Direct Experience"). Therein he describes
the raja yoga (the royal yoga) in 16 steps, which is a more detailed and
expanded form of astanga yoga (eight-limbed yoga). Pranayama is explained in
Jnana (Knowledge) terms as exhalation of the misidentification with the body
(deham naham, The body is not I), inhalation as Ko'ham (Who am I?), and
retention as So'ham (He am I; "He" refers to Siva). While it is fine to
meditate in this manner with the breath, the original intention of the
spiritual instruction by Sri Sankara and Sri Ramana is purely that of Jnana,
referencing the breath in a symbolic way only.
The passage to which you refer is, perhaps, from the Katha
Upanishad. The recitations in Sanskrit and English toward the conclusion of
satsang are from several sources. Some are from various Upanishads, some are
from Bhagavad Gita, Ashtavakra Gita, Avadhuta Gita, and similar traditional
scriptures. Usually, chapters from the Ribhu Gita, in Tamil and English, are
recited during retreats at the SAT Temple. You can easily determine which
text is being recited, and sometimes even the section or chapter, by
referring to the catalogue of recordings for the date of any particular
satsang.
May your inquiry be deep so that Self remains revealed in all of its
perfection.
Ever yours in Truth,
Nome
Dear Murali, I agree Robert Adams has a wonderful,direct style of teaching. His 20 years in India is a complete mystery; I'd love to find out more about what he saw and experienced.
Meanwhile, I've come across a website of Edward Muzikas who claims Robert Adams wife and new partner have watered down Roberts teaching and Christianised it for Western consumption. If that's true, it's a great pity!
Hi Ravi, The DVD Abhishiktananda An Interior Journey {the spirit of insight and awakening} duration 87 minutes. www.InnerDirections.org
Furthermore, I agree that the essence of all great religions are the same but from the top of the mountain where Ramakrishna sat in bliss; he can say that from direct experience. With our rajasic minds and conditioning can we say the same?
Scott/Friends,
Thanks Scott for sharing the correspondence with Master Nome.They are full of wisdom and encouragement.
"Repression does not succeed in the destruction of ignorance. It is
like holding a piece of wood under the surface of water. As soon as the hold
is released, the wood bobs to the surface again. Likewise is it with the
suppression of thoughts, inclusive of those that you refer to as emotions.
Without true Knowledge, they reappear. "
This is quite true and Fundamental.I will add a little to this-while repression and indulgence does not help-How does one practically handle this?
The Yogic Way is to simply REFUSE CONSENT-NO EMOTION LASTS FOREVER.Repeated refusals gradually weaken these Vasanas.Just like the vasanas are strengthened with every indulgence,they get weakened with every refusal.What is created by thought can be annuled by Thought.
This is like how we go about cleaning the Floor.If there are Gross junk strewn around,we Haul them up first.Next we sweep the finer dust.Lastly the Mopping is done.
It is useful to recognize the distinction between REFUSAL and SUPPRESSION.In Refusal one is AWARE that one needs to weather the storm of Negative emotion;in Repression,a greater part of the mind is craving indulgence, while the outward(external) part of the mind is stalemating the expression of it-and is perpetually caught in this stalemate,often getting swept away and succumbing to the vasanas.
This is a period of preparation that requires patience and firm resolve,a sort of Doggedness-This is What Vairagya is all about.
When the Clouds clear and the sun peeps out,Go ahead with the Sadhana at full steam.
As the Gita says-No Right Effort goes waste.
Namaskar.
Read that Ramesh Balsekar has died.
A disciple of the great teacher Nisargadatta. Balsekar had his own
followers but the greatness of Nisargadatta Maharaj outshone all
'pretenders' to the throne.
.
... Anonymous, I'd love to find out more about what he saw and experienced. ...
Do you know this site:
The World and 'you' are Appearance Only
It contains a lot of personal stories about Robert Adams. I don't know whether this site is from Edward Muzaki, but the owner of this site claims:
"I understand that there were sites in the past that posted many of Robert's transcripts and talks, but were forced to remove them when (...removed by CVR...) threatened to sue those who were trying to present Robert's teachings for free.
"I cannot be successfully sued as I have the original recordings and I understand that therefore I own the copyright to the actual soundtracks of Robert's voice."
.
Hi Clemens, I had a look at the site 'The world and you are appearence only'.It could very well be Edward Musika. I believe
his wife thinks she has ownership of whatever Robert Adams
said. I think it's called intellectual property rights.
You can't appropriate that which is universal!
Anonymous,
Thanks very much for the site reference.
As regards the Essence of all Religions being the same-in as much as peace and Love are the objectives of all Religions-Fundamental to all seeking and striving-to whatever degree we have experienced these things (and which one has not!)points to this fundamental Truth.
Namaskar.
Friends,
Wish to share this poem by Kavi Yogi Shuddhanda Bharati;the yogi's Tamil biography of Sri Bhagavan -Ramana Vijayam-is higly inspirational.He also wrote the Biography of Sri Annamalai Swami in Tamil-'Annamalai Munivar'; perhaps the first biography on Sri Annamalai Swami.
Now back to this poem:
Trees are many; the grove is one
Branches are many; tree is one
Shores are many; sea is one
Limbs are many; body is one
Bodies many; Self is one
Stars are many; Sky is one
Flowers are many; honey is one
Pages are many; book is one
Thoughts are many; Thinker is one
Tastes are many; taster is one
Actors are many; the drama is one
Nations are many; World is one
Religions are many; Truth is one
The wise are many; Wisdom is one
Beings are many; Breath is one
Classes are many; College is one
Find out this One behind the many
Then life shall enjoy peaceful harmony.
—Yogi Shuddhananda Bharati
Namaskar.
The book Silence of The Heart is transcripts of Robert Adams satsangs. So even if someone is appropriating it, watering it down, etc. There is always the direct source available. So I suppose it doesn't matter.
My teacher's two most recent responses. The second one is in response to intensely rageful thoughts. i wasn't going to act on them, but it elicited a quick response from him. The first one, I thought was profound in response to my thoughts abotu inquiry focusing on the elimination of problems. It seemed he was suggesting I go further then that.
Dear Kassy,
>
> Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya
>
> Namaste. Thank you for your several messages.
>
> The Maharshi's teachings reveal something far vaster and deeper than
> the resolution of personal problems. To apply them to such problems, of
> course, works, just as applying the whole ocean to extinguish an ignited
> match that is singing your finger will certainly work, but we would not
say
> that this is the entire purpose and scope of the ocean.
>
> If you turn within, you will find the illimitable source of
> happiness, which is also the abode of love. Becoming absorbed in that, you
> will see how false, needless, and purposeless have been all the ideas of
> cravings, fears, hatred, anger, and the other tendencies with which your
> mind has plagued itself.
>
> Understanding that a thought is transient may be a fine place to
> start. It is not the end and, by itself, does not destroy ignorance, which
> will produce the idea, the attachment, the suffering, and the problem
again.
> For permanent freedom, inquiry to know oneself is the direct means.
>
> Most, if not all, of your other questions and comments have already
> been dealt with multiple times in previous correspondence, in
> "Self-Knowledge" and other books, in satsangs, in the recorded satsangs,
> etc., so reiteration here is unnecessary. It is wise to continue going
over
> these. It is also important to fully use your capacity to engage in
> spiritual practice.
>
> May your inquiry be steady and deep so that you leave behind the
> imagined bondage of the mind and remain happy at heart and at peace.
>
> Ever yours in Truth,
>
> Nome
Dear Kassy,
Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya
Namaste. The Maharshi has declared, and it has long been proclaimed
by the rishis of the Vedas and yogis throughout the centuries, that ahimsa
is first, or foremost, among spiritual beings. Ahimsa means non-injury. It
means that one should not cause any harm with body, speech, or mind to any
living beings. This includes being non-injurious to those that you like and
those you do not. As indicated in my previous messages to you, find the deep
source of love within so that you feel love toward all beings. Within does
not mean interior to the body. Such would only be a limited material
viewpoint. In a spiritual context, within means subjective, the nonobjective
Consciousness or the essential Being.
If you yearn for spiritual peace, it is imperative that you dissolve
your thoughts of violent hatred, etc.
It would be difficult for any reasonable person to consider your
ideas of being bothered by all the people, whom you do not even know,
mentioned by you as actual occurrences rather than figments of imagination
born of your own mental difficulties. The interpretation of flight paths by
airplanes, etc. may reflect the absurdity and extent of imagination rather
than have a basis in actual fact.
A peaceful vessel, vowed to ahimsa, is fit to contain the nectar of
spiritual Knowledge.
Doubts of self-defense and righteous action as portrayed in the Gita
are inapplicable in this case because of the basis of delusive thinking in
your present state of mind and because of the Gita's insistence on universal
love, absence of hatred, equanimity, absence of desire, etc. as a basis for
action.
By whatever means that you find helpful, free your mind of this
delusive manner of thinking. You will be much happier for it.
Ever yours in Truth,
Nome
"Read that Ramesh Balsekar has died.
A disciple of the great teacher Nisargadatta. Balsekar had his own
followers but the greatness of Nisargadatta Maharaj outshone all
'pretenders' to the throne."
Was ramesh Baleskar a pretender to the throne. And if he was, what makes you think that he was?
Pretending would seem really futile, and if I still suffer or have the potentil to suffer. It seems like pretending, which I'm not sure anyone does, would not seem worthwhile, when it's realize that this teaching perhaps offers something far greater then what can be gotten from pretending to be something I'm not, or Realize deeper then I do. I jsut wouldn't see the point in doing that. In general assume that those who have a grasp of where this teaching is pointing would no better then pretending. Infact, many of the people I thought were frauds, or totally misled, sometimes seemed to have a deeper understanding then I gave them credit for. I gave up on thinking I could evaluate people's spiritual states, or lack of. My teacher, who to my satisfaction I believe to be fully Realized, a jnani. Umm, there was nothing odd about his behavior, and I would almost say that more then anything else, I found pretty astounding, or awe-inspiring, taht someone could function like a normal person, not even seem "spiritual" or Realized at first glance, wear casual clothes (though he was exceedingly nice and unassuming), and be immersed in the Self, and know the world is only an appearance. Though the grace I experienced around him was intensely profound and intense and indescribable. Just even when I get into talking like I know and I don't, it feels icky, and unworthwhile, nothing compared to being merged in Blissful Conscoiusness harmoniousness like cumin seed in water. Whatever my state of maturity, the latter definitely has a greater pull.
"The Yogic Way is to simply REFUSE CONSENT-NO EMOTION LASTS FOREVER.Repeated refusals gradually weaken these Vasanas.Just like the vasanas are strengthened with every indulgence,they get weakened with every refusal.What is created by thought can be annuled by Thought."
This is very intuitive and true. But, while passing through the storm, the method looks so artificial and at that time, the only direction I am dragged is to succumb and go deeper into despondency.
I am in a high pressure job and always fall into situations where thoughts of helplessness and despondency pull me down. i make every attempt to throw off those thoughts "while passing through the situations" but, all attempts look very artificial. I try to maintain the attitude that whatever I am passing through has been directly ordained by Bhagavan but the thought looks very weak.
I would request some personal examples from all of you in implementing this method.
Thanks
Regards Murali
I really like the way Michael James relates things to Christianity. he was talking about how Self-attention and the Christian Concept of "holy indifference" are referring to the same thing. That made me even think of Catherine of Sienna, a saint centuries ago, who clearly was abiding in Nirvikalpa samadhi, and was probably a jnani from what i read about her. And she would like Maharshi be in states where she was completely unresponsive to the outside world.
Hi, Losing m mind,
Ramesh Balsekar was a very articulate teacher and no doubt charismatic. Neverthesless he could charge hefty fees and there were allegations of serial misconduct.
Make of it what you will.
Nisargadatta was there for all and never charged a penny.
Balsekar was no more then a lucid
exponent of Nisargadattas teaching.
.
... Murali, I would request some personal examples from all of you in implementing this method. ...
I think you are doing it quite right, Murali. It needs practice - that's all. There is your understanding, there is your conscious diving into yourself, there is trust in the teaching, there is the desire to be free of the mind - nothing is missed.
Any personal experience could hardly say more then TALK 398:
-----------
D.: How can the rebellious mind be brought under control?
M.: Either seek its source so that it may disappear or surrender that it may be struck down.
D.: But the mind slips away from our control.
M.: Be it so. Do not think of it. When you recollect yourself bring it back and turn it inward. That is enough.
No one succeeds without effort. Mind control is not one’s birthright. The successful few owe their success to their perseverance.
-----------
Let all thoughts come and go and do not react on them. If you have reacted then be it so. The next time you will not react anymore. Be a companion, a friend of this ego elefant and simply watch what it is doing, what it wants. By observing the mind continually it becomes weaker. In the passing of the years the mind will gradually disappear.
.
On what Murali said. I wish I was qualified to answer. Of course, those are the kinds of things that happen for me. Not about the same thing, but when "thoughts" arise they are intense vasanas that are despairing. They aren't usually mild. The only thing I've found that works for me, really is writing that teacher. But I guess that fits under surrender. If I didn't have that teacher, maybe even I would write letters to Bhagavan. Because it is I think casting the burden. I was reading some of the articles in Happiness and the Art of Being by Michael James. He was talking about self-attention. It occurs to me that what you describe is normal in the course of sadhana and that is exactly what motivates sadhana is the fire of samsara being too hot to handle, and being more magnetically drawn to self-attention, and more and more seeing the power of it. In some of the more recently experiences that seemed kind of samadhi-ish that I've had, it almost felt like attention magnetically drawn back on itself like an electric current. So basically for me, it seems like grace is necessary for despairing vasanas. From the tone of the letters I've gotten from that teacher, it seems he advocates using the intensity of suffering and turning it into the intensity of practice. I wish I was a jnani because otherwise I don't think it is possible really to give advise for someone else's situation. Except that it does seem that Maharshi's teachings are the antidote ultimately for problems such as brought up by Murali. It's just a matter at keeping at it. Surrender, inquiry, whatever we understand of it. Association with a sat-guru. It seems like Murali already has found nannagaru.(and had darshan) He seems genuinely qualified.(I remember Maharshi saying that one who has had the grace of the guru will surely be saved, it's just a matter of practice) Just a matter of spending time with him, I would think. Once there is that association, my experience is that there is no problem too big for a jnani.
wasn't sure it was sent the first time, doesn't need to be reposted, if it was already.
On what Murali said. I wish I was qualified to answer. Of course, those are the kinds of things that happen for me. Not about the same thing, but when "thoughts" arise they are intense vasanas that are despairing. They aren't usually mild. The only thing I've found that works for me, really is writing that teacher. But I guess that fits under surrender. If I didn't have that teacher, maybe even I would write letters to Bhagavan. Because it is I think casting the burden. I was reading some of the articles in Happiness and the Art of Being by Michael James. He was talking about self-attention. It occurs to me that what you describe is normal in the course of sadhana and that is exactly what motivates sadhana is the fire of samsara being too hot to handle, and being more magnetically drawn to self-attention, and more and more seeing the power of it. In some of the more recently experiences that seemed kind of samadhi-ish that I've had, it almost felt like attention magnetically drawn back on itself like an electric current. So basically for me, it seems like grace is necessary for despairing vasanas. From the tone of the letters I've gotten from that teacher, it seems he advocates using the intensity of suffering and turning it into the intensity of practice. I wish I was a jnani because otherwise I don't think it is possible really to give advise for someone else's situation. Except that it does seem that Maharshi's teachings are the antidote ultimately for problems such as brought up by Murali. It's just a matter at keeping at it. Surrender, inquiry, whatever we understand of it. Association with a sat-guru. It seems like Murali already has found nannagaru.(and had darshan) He seems genuinely qualified.(I remember Maharshi saying that one who has had the grace of the guru will surely be saved, it's just a matter of practice) Just a matter of spending time with him, I would think. Once there is that association, my experience is that there is no problem too big for a jnani.
It seems to me that is why, for instance on reading the Power of the Presence Maharshi's devotees associated with him. Because life sucks. It doesn't suck when there is grace, and Bliss. And so there was a gravitation to that source that was able to bring that into their lives. Think of where all those devotees would have been without Maharshi. I think that is why, having found this teacher, I'm not hesitant about sharing the most embarresing problems because ultimately the association with the guru is association with the Self, and it infuses the life with something that actually makes life good, and my thoughts and actions wiser, but ultimately even leads to being totally merged in Blissful experience. It just seems so important to practice what one understands whatever it is. And for instance, before I knew of Self-inquiry, I practiced yoga, or tai chi, or whatever was available, it seems like when there is earnestness toward practicing whatever practice is available at that point it leads to deeper practice. When I knew of Self-inquiry but did not have a guru, I practiced dilligently to the degree I understood, and it almost seems like the point of it was to Realize my own powerlessness so I was humble enough to have a guru. (which I can say for me is still not very humble) I was even thinking on David Godman saying that one earns being in the presence of the guru. Part of it seems to me to be the recognition of a qualified teacher which comes from humility. Think of the people (for instance those Rangan brought with him) who saw Maharshi, but said that he wasn't good enough. those who recognized Maharshi's greatness, it probably meant that they had indeed earned their way. And those who couldn't, and thought he was just some guy in a loincloth chopping onions hadn't. Those that needed a sage to appear in a certain ostentatious way (and can't recognize a real sage), are the one's who aren't ready, and perhaps don't find a real teacher at that point until they've earnestly practiced what they are given to practice. I've also noticed that every stage of earnest practice on my part, led to being forced to recognize my own powerlessness to a greater extent.(in life or spirituality) Becuase ultimately in Realization or even samadhi, it seems samadhi transpires when the sense of powerlessness or giving up self occurs, and so the surrender is deeper. Maharshi did say I believe, "our greatest glory is where we cease to exist".
hello.I am shiba.
I have a question.It is about a book 'A practical guide to know yourself: Conversations with Sri Ramana Maharshi'.
What kind of conversations is contained in this book?Is this book like 'BE AS YOU ARE'? I have a book 'talk with sri ramana maharshi' . Does the book 'A practical..' contain same conversations with 'talk with...'?
.
... Nisargadatta was there for all and never charged a penny. ...
The complete absence of monetary interests is unfortunately indeed very seldom.
This is the last or one of the last books with talks of Nisargadatta: I am Unborn. My impression of this book is that the reader can feel in it that this talk happened shortly before His death.
.
Murali,
I recommend to you the Excellent Book 'Thought power' by Swami Sivananda.You can download it from this site:
http://hinduism.about.com/od/ebooksetextdownloads/qt/thoughtpower.htm
The other Resource that deals with Practical Problems faced by Sadhaks is Sri Aurobindo's 'Letters on Yoga'.(It may take a while to familiarise with the Terminology;once one gets past this,this is a veritable encyclopaedia on All aspects of Sadhana)
Here is an Excerpt from 'Letters on Yoga':
"All the difficulties you describe are quite natural things common
to most people. It is easy for one, comparatively, to remember
and be conscious when one sits quiet in meditation; it is difficult
when one has to be busy with work. The remembrance and
consciousness in work have to come by degrees, you must not
expect to have it all at once; nobody can get it all at once. It
comes in two ways, – first, if one practises remembering the
Mother and offering the work to her each time one does something
(not all the time one is doing, but at the beginning or whenever
one can remember,) then that slowly becomes easy and
habitual to the nature. Secondly, by the meditation an inner consciousness
begins to develop which, after a time, not at once or
suddenly, becomes more and more automatically permanent.
One feels this as a separate consciousness from that outer which
works. At first this separate consciousness is not felt when one
is working, but as soon as the work stops one feels it was there
all the time watching from behind; afterwards it begins to be felt
during the work itself, as if there were two parts of oneself –
one watching and supporting from behind and remembering
Mother and offering to her and the other doing the work. When
this happens, then to work with the true consciousness becomes
more and more easy."
continued...
Murali,
Sri Aurobindo's 'Letters On Yoga' Continued:
"It is the same with all the rest. It is by the development of
the inner consciousness that all the things you speak of will be
set right. For instance it is a part of the being that has utsÀha
for the work, another that feels the pressure of quietude and is
not so disposed to work. Your mood depends on which comes
up at the time – it is so with all people. To combine the two is
difficult, but a time comes when they do get reconciled – one
remains poised in an inner concentration while the other is supported
by it in its push towards work. The transformation of the
nature, the harmonising of all these discordant things in the being
are the work of sadhana. Therefore you need not be discouraged
by observing these things in you. There is hardly anybody
who has not found these things in himself. All this can be arranged
by the action of the inner Force with the constant consent
and call of the sadhak. By himself he might not be able to
do it, but with the Divine Force working within all can be done."
-----------------------------------
Murali,What I have expressed is based on personal experience only.
With Regard to pressure of work,the Challenge posed by work is onething but how we respond to it is another.We need to only put in the effort that is called for,and the Result is not in our Hnads.So no need to put ourself in a Pressure cooker situation worrying about the Result.
The Key thing is to somehow find an anchor deep within;Devotion and Faith are the essence and if one can find these during the period of calm,one simply remains oriented in this direction during the storm.To the extent we Dig deep during the calm hours,to that extent we let the storm pass without being uprooted.The other thing is that these 'Storms' have a habit of recurring at regular intervals.With each weathering they reduce in intensity and Frequency.IT IS USEFUL TO REMEMBER THIS NATURE OF THE STORMS and this would help to hold on till they subside.Humility and Patience will wear out these seemingly insuperable difficulties.
Wish you the Very Best.
Namaskar.
i was just musing I've benefited from these teachings, in a real human way. It is really apparent (laugh), if you read my comments last year, and this year. The clarity growth is apparent. I was also reading some of the dialogue from others, that at the time, I was too immersed in problems to really notice. There was alot of it seems hostility directed back and forth. I was amazed at some of the mean-ness. But it made me think in one of the the Power of the Presence essays how Ramana said in response to why devotees are displaying so much more ego, that it is like a pot boiling over. And at the time, I would have, and maybe until recently responded to indignation to mean-ness. But there gets to be more understanding that other people's egoic issues are no different from my own, no matter how outwardly different it looks. There is a deepening of compassion, less willingness to differentiate and hate others. Realizing there is no real difference or betterness because I don't say something mean, but just think it. In my correspondence with my sat-guru (what else to call him, anything else would be pretending something other then my actual opinion on the matter). I've been really focusing on not only eliminating the transient as problems, but once off the "problem-level" merging with pure consciousness. It works pretty well, I felt intensely Blissful all day. Great conversations with others. On nisargadatta. It is noteable that actual jnanis do not care for material wealth. But I still would be hesitant about saying someone isn't a jnani based on my own mind's interpretation. I could definitely be wrong.
Dear Ravi, Clemens and Losing M Mind,
Thanks for all the encouragement and guidance. It was great.
There is a saying in my mother tongue (Telugu) to the effect that "What we sin smiling, we suffer sobbing". This is especially in the context that whatever we experience outside as well as inside must have been some painful habit cultivated in the past "similingly". I read somewhere that even the Ego is nothing but an ancient habit cultivated over lifetimes. Bhagavan somewhere mentioned (in the Ocean of Grace) that Fear, Anxiety and uncertainity are the definition of the ego. Stringing all these togther, as you all mentioned, painful practice is the the only way of all these.
Regards Murali
.
... money and spirituality ...
We have a master here in Germany giving darshan. Once a day I talked with a close disciple of him about the charging of money for this darshans. This disciple said that charging money would stop troublemakers to come to this meetings.
It is interesting to compare this kind of small-minded thinking with the generous spirit of true spirituality.
.
Dear Friends,
Today I found the following two narrations from both Bhagavan and also Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa. It is coincidental that I came across these today, when we were all having exchanges on the necessity of persistant practice.
---------------------------------
The following is from "Kitchen workers" in Power of Presence:
Once while I was meditating in the presence of Bhagavan, my mind persisted in wandering. I couldn't control it so I gave up meditating and opened my eyes.
Bhagavan at once sat up and said "Oh! You abandon meditation thinking it is nature (swabhava) of the mind to wander. Whatever we practise becomes the swabhava. If control is practised persistently, that will become the swabhava"
-----------------------------------
The following is from Sri Ramakrishna Bodhamritam. I read it in Telugu and I am doing a free translation.
"Once a person had a pet dog. He pampered the dog for many years and the dog used to take unusual liberties on the person. It used to jump on the owner, lick him and do many such things.
Once a sadhu came to the house of the person and saw his attachment to the dog. He warned him to reduce the attachment as it is detrimental to the spiritual development. The person decided to decrease his involvement with the dog. The next day, the dog, as usual jumped at the person but he did not entertain the liberties. He took a stick and warned the dog. The dog got confused because it has been used to a particular behaviour for a long time. It could not change its behaviour at once. Whenever the dog came, the person was not allowing it to jump on him. Gradually, the dog understood that things changed and learnt the new rules.
Similar is the case with emotions like Kama, krodha, etc., You have nurtured them for so many lives and they will not leave you at once. You have to beat them as soon as they rise and this process has to be done persistantly and overtime, they will not approach you"
-----------------------------------------
What follows is a letter from my sat-guru on this subject.
In contrast to what Murali said, my teacher had said that spiritual practice is always joyful, and I've heard him say that in satsang as well. I was just thinking this is something to keep in mind. If it really dissolves the bondage, the experience is joyful. Which is funny beause right now, I'm in one of those moments where i feel the onset of problems, and that it is imperative that I find a way to inquire so that I do stay in joy. My teacher though did say in satsang to me that the suffering in the world that drives the intensity of spiritual practice is the fire. Right now, I feel the fire.
Dear Kassy,
Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya
Namaste. Thank you for your messages.
A good approach to spiritual practice, in the understanding that its
joy and freedom are surpassed only by the final Realization, is that no kind
of bondage is insuperable, being only illusory, and the true Self is ever
present, yet whatever time is required to completely destroy the bondage is
happily well-spent.
As you deepen the inquiry, the distinction between activity and
inactivity of the body, senses, etc. will completely disappear, for the Self
is ever the same, unborn and imperishable.
It is not difficult to correctly, precisely pursue realization of
the Self, for every step you make in that direction reveals peace and bliss,
just as, contrariwise, a step into delusion yields the suffering that
reminds one to go back the way she came. The Grace is always there; one has
only to inquire to experience it. In one sense, the efforts made are
infinitesimal in contrast to the magnitude of Grace, the Truth of the Self,
of the nature of Sat-Cit-Ananda (Being-Consciousness-Bliss). So, it is a
case of Grace for the sake of Grace. That is the real Existence; the ego is
nothing at all.
May your inquiry continue to deepen so that you abide steadily in
the Self, as the Self, the self-luminous Reality.
Ever yours in Truth,
Nome
Also in my experience, practicing out of my 'problems' is not painful. In my case the difficulty is not that practice is painful, but that problems and ego are addictive. Especially craving. Even if I'm craving for something I don't have, and suffering, there is an addiction to the source of craving. But if I do actually REALLY practice and turn away from the suffering and attachment, Bliss reveals itself. And then it is joyful. It's just hard in the sense of maybe jumping off a diving board, once I do it it is fun, before I do it, it is scary.
Hello all. I just wanted to let you know that you can acquire a flash drive with all of Robert Adams original recorded talks on it from Ed Muzika for a small charge. I thought that Roberts written teachings were amazing, but the recordings are even better. It is one of the greatest tools I have come across for my continual practice. Also, as great a tool as it is, it is only ever pointing towards our own truth and silence. I believe Ed's email is on the website
http://itisnotreal.com/
This was a dialogue with my teacher. I thought it was good. It was someone else dialoguing with him in Satsang.
Q.: The thing that comes closest in my story is justice.
N.: What do you mean by justice?
Q.: Fairness, opportunity, no starvation, people have a place
to sleep, some kind of security.
N.: These are all noble ideals. Where does their nobility stem
from?
16
Q.: I read them in a book.
N.: Where did the book writer get them from? (laughter)
Q.: Dr. [Martin] Luther King.
N.: Where did he get them from?
Q.: He said he got it from God, but I do not know that to be
the truth.
N.: You just like the fruit of it, but you are not sure of the
root, is that it?
Q.: Yes. The just always felt to me the purpose and great
highness. I do not know that to be the truth.
N.: What is true?
Q.: Real. It is an impact of what is happening. I am not sure
I can explain it.
N.: Perhaps, you should find out more about that. What is
real? What is true?
Q.: Going back to sensations, that has been my measurement.
N.: Your senses perceive such a small amount. How could
you find what is true and real in that way?
Q.: Very little. I have not always known that. I was brought
up in a very narrow thinking type of mode, strong suppression
of emotions, and all that kind of stuff.
N.: All that is ancient history. You can not use that as an
excuse for the present state of mind.
Q.: No, I do not want to do that. I am just telling you where
I came from.
N.: Finding out what is true, what is real, is essential and has
a lot to do with the ultimate or highest purpose of life. It has a
lot to do with the source of all the things that are good, beautiful
and virtuous, some of which you were describing. They have
a source. Some call that source God, some call it the Self, and
some call it Brahman. There are many other terms for it as well.
17
If you find out deeply within yourself, in full experience, what
that source is, you will be fulfilling the purpose of life and you
will find a happiness that never comes to an end.
I will give you a hint that is quite common in Advaita
Vedanta teaching to finding out what is true. The first consideration
regarding what is true, what is real, is that it is always, eternal,
ever-existent. If something comes and goes, it is considered
unreal. Only that which endures, without a moment's interruption—
and is consequently beginningless and endless—is real.
The only thing that is regarded as true about you is, likewise, that
which is all the time, without a beginning or birth, and without
an end or death. What comes and goes is just accidental and
not true about you at all.
Not one of your sensations endures forever. They are very
short-lived. What you have known through them is not at all the
truth. If you want to know the truth, find that which is existent
always, never interrupted, and not sporadic. How can you find
that which exists always? Start with your own existence.
Q.: Is that the body?
N.: No. The body comes and goes. It has a birth and a death,
and you are aware of it only in the waking state. It is not constant.
You need to look for that which is constant, uninterrupted,
and ever-existent. What has a beginning and an end is not
true even in the middle; it is just a false appearance. What is
truly real exists always and never becomes unreal even for a
moment. Search your experience, outwardly, inwardly, and in
any direction you like, and see if you can find that which always
exists. Once you have found that, you will also have found the
source of happiness that is perpetual, and this inquiry, this
Knowledge, this Vedanta, will become very important to you.
Then you will dive in to know that Existence first hand, permanently,
and you will be at the very root of all that is good, true,
and beautiful.
Q.: Thank you.
Om, shanti, shanti, shanti
Om, Om, Om (Silence)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEIfMqM5wnM
I forgot to mention, that it was a Krishnamurti clip, that was really good.
I agree with Losing M. Mind that if critically analysed, turning towards Self should ultimately be joyful.
I think the pain is
1. In the intial stages when the "Joy" is not yet experienced
2. The frustration of going against the stream of habitual thought patterns
I hope these are all initial stages and once the Joy of the Self starts being felt, that itself is an incentive to plough on.
Regards Murali
It's almost like ajnanis and there drama only exists to call attention to the epic quality of the lives of saints. And that world history, is only the history of saints. That is the only thing that is substantial. And the more that is realized, the more one becomes one. Because the attention, fascination becomes only jnana, and jnanis.
Krishnamurti on Who am I?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7G-7-ZiiM-o&feature=related
musical accompaniement:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVadl4ocX0M&feature=fvw
Every aspect of this blog is profound!
Murali,
Thanks very much for those typical teachings from Sri Bhagavan and Thakur.The 'coincidence' is not accidental-it is in this way that earnestness is always answered.
Thakur gives this assurance that even imitation can lead to results!An Excerpt from the the chapter 'With the devotees at Dakshineswar':
Sri Ramakrishna spoke reassuringly to the devotees.
MASTER (to M.): "Some think: 'Oh, I am a bound soul. I shall never acquire knowledge and devotion.' But if one receives the guru's grace, one has nothing to fear. Once a tigress attacked a flock of goats. As she sprang on her prey, she gave birth to a cub and died. The cub grew up in the company of the goats. The goats ate grass and the cub followed their example. They bleated; the cub bleated too. Gradually it grew to be a big tiger. One day another tiger attacked the same flock. It was amazed to see the grass-eating tiger. Running after it, the wild tiger at last seized it, whereupon the grass-eating tiger began to bleat. The wild tiger dragged it to the water and said: 'Look at your face in the water. It is just like mine. Here is a little meat. Eat it.' Saying this, it thrust some meat into its mouth. But the grass-eating tiger would not swallow it and began to bleat again. Gradually, however, it got the taste for blood and came to relish the meat. Then the wild tiger said: 'Now you see there is no difference between you and me. Come along and follow me into the forest.'
"So there can be no fear if the guru's grace descends on one. He will let you know who you are and what your real nature is.
"If the devotee practises spiritual discipline a little, the guru explains everything to him. Then the disciple understands for himself what is real and what is unreal. God alone is real, and the world is illusory.
Parable of the false ascetic
"One night a fisherman went into a garden and cast his net into the lake in order to steal some fish. The owner heard him and surrounded him with his servants. They brought lighted torches and began to search for him. In the mean time the fisherman smeared his body with ashes and sat under a tree, pretending to be a holy man. The owner and his men searched a great deal but could not find the thief. All they saw was a holy man covered with ashes, meditating under a tree. The next day the news spread in the neighbourhood that a great sage was staying in the garden. People gathered there and saluted him with offerings of fruit, flowers, and sweets. Many also offered silver and copper coins. 'How strange!' thought the fisherman. 'I am not a genuine holy man, and still people show such devotion to me. I shall certainly realize God if I become a true sadhu. There is no doubt about it.'
"If a mere pretence of religious life can bring such spiritual awakening, you can imagine the effect of real sadhana. In that state you will surely realize what is real and what is unreal. God alone is real, and the world is illusory."
One of the devotees said to himself: "Is the world unreal, then? The fisherman, to be sure, renounced worldly life. What, then, will happen to those who live in the world? Must they too renounce it?" Sri Ramakrishna, who could see into a man's innermost thought, said very tenderly: "Suppose an office clerk has been sent to jail. He undoubtedly leads a prisoner's life there. But when he is released from jail, does he cut capers in the street? Not at all. He gets a job as a clerk again and goes on working as before. Even after attaining Knowledge through the guru's grace, one can very well live in the world as a Jivanmukta." Thus did Sri Ramakrishna reassure those who were living as householders.
-----------------------------------
Wish you the very Best.
Namaskar.
Hi Clemens, 'This disciple said that charging money would stop troublemakers from coming to the meeting" If he was honest he would have said it's simply a "grab for cash"
I don't know what to make of this
'spiritual scene' gurus in silk
pygamas and other costumes. There's the inner circle and then the outer 'plebs'
Perhaps the only thing to do in this circus atmosphere is to 'keep quiet'
Scott,
"And that world history, is only the history of saints. That is the only thing that is substantial."
Well said.Truly the Glory of the Sages is incomparable.
That is probably why it is best not to worry about who is or is not a charlatan. If someone helps you feel the Bliss and the egolessness and the peace, if soemthing read has that effect, it is good. If it doesn't, it is insubstantial and unimportant. I thought I could judge with the mind who is and who isn't a jnani. If someone makes me lose feeling embodied and feel like pure Blissful Cosnciousness in their presence. I assume they probably are a jnani. If not I can't tell. In that sense it seems easier to tell who is one in their presence, then who is not one. Is Gangaji a jnani? Burt Harding? Echart Tolle?
No idea. They could be. Silk robes? An organization? Charging money? One reason that seems like it could still present a problem in judging. Is of course, a jnani, an atma purusha who has transcended the world has no attachment to fame, or money. That makes kind of an obvious sense to it. But even Maharshi said that he had no control, nor tried to of those around him, did not condone or condemn asking for donations. And was not necessarily a sympthetic ear when people griped about the way his brother had ostensibly treated them. "Mind why you have came". So what the jnani wears, what kinds of rituals they engage in, the kinds of religions or organizations formed around them, I wonder if that can really be proof of the spiritual state of the jnani themselves. With that teacher I correspond with, and from my experiences being around him, and correspondence I actually have pretty much not a shred of doubt that he is an atma purusha or a jivanmukta (although you can and that is perfectly fine). And it was interesting to me, the gossip about him, gossip I would have been prone to believe prior. Except my own experiential evidence is directly contrary to it. (for instance 124 pages of selfless responses from him for free) That teacher he doesn't try to refute it. And there were interesting things, like when his brother was involved, they did charge money and it sounds like maybe it was mandatory. But I'm almost relying on that gossip.(no idea whether that is true) But after the brother left perhaps on bad terms, I felt like no one cared whether I left donations or not. Hardly anything was charged for, the books and CDs are cheap. Also it does seem to me, even looking at Maharshi, is that weird things and behavior and organizations and politics do sprout up around the Jnani. And then as far as dress look at the differences between Krishnamurti and Maharshi. Even the way they explain that the individual is an illusion and a bundle of thoughts. In essence they agree with eachother, but Krishnamurti has such a roundabout way of explaining it that Papaji said he was "enlightened but a bad teacher". (laugh). So I think it is interesting. I think Jnanis and there differences, and there inability to be grasped by sensory means is interesting.
I was just thinking, I wonder if there is a difference (in appearance or behavior or speech) between jnanis who Realized young, and those who REalized older. I was just thinking about that, because after writing my teacher a bunch, he accidentally e-mailed me, and it was meant for someone else, and he was saying to disregard it. And there was something so impersonal about it, but at the same time, a hint that if the Self didn't mean to write me it wouldn't have, so there was some importance even though he said disregard it. And I was just thinking of the strange, impersonal manner of his interactions, even though the non-verbal interactions were exceedingly warm when I was in his presence. His speech pattern is almost littered with aphorisms. His story anyway, (which I believe), is that he Realized the Self in his teenage years, but differently then Ramana after an intense sadhana motivated partly by life threatening asthma, and a nirvikalpa experience in a park. I think some of my teacher's interaction habits, and strange eccentricities remind me more of Ramana Maharshi then they remind me of Papaji. (who seemd pretty much a very normal though exceedingly charming prince). And I was wondering if there was something to attaining Realization before the brain has had a chance to develope alot of life experiences. For instance, I haven't had a whole lot of one on one interaction, and it's not that his behavior is deficient. But I have trouble believing that my teacher would carry on a lengthy conversation about anything besides these teachings.And even in this e-mail which in his telling me to disregard it, mentioned a few non-spiritual matters, it was very flat and impersonal. I could imagine Papaji actually getting seemingly excited about things besides nondual Realization and having some life talking about them. Granted, this is my own interpretation, I don't even know if this is true, per se.
Hi Losing m mind, I think you'll find that Ramana Maharshi actually
forbade his brother to solicit donations in his name.
Anonymous/Friends,
Coming to soliciting Donations(or the Opposite of it!)Sri Bhagavan is GOLD REFERENCE in all ways-Peerless.Here is an Excerpt from 'Letters from Ramanasramam':
5th February, 1946
(36) KOWPINAVANTAH KHALU
BHAGYAVANTAH
(FORTUNATE ARE THOSE
WITH A MERE LOINCLOTH)
You know, off and on, Bhagavan has been going
through Sri Ramana Leela, which has recently been received
from the printers. In that connection, Rangaswami asked
yesterday, “Has the story about the towel been written in it?”
As it was not in the book, Bhagavan told us as follows:
“About forty years back — perhaps in 1906 — when I
was in Pachiamman Koil, I had with me only one Malayalam
towel. It was given to me by somebody. As the material was
flimsy it became worn out within two months and was torn in
several places. Palaniswami was not in town. I had therefore
to look after the cooking and all other domestic work. As I
used to dry my feet and hands with the towel every now and
then, it got all sorts of colours. Its condition would be seen if I
used it as a cover for the body. So I used to roll it and keep it
near at hand. What did it matter to me? It was enough if the
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 63
required work gets done with its help. After bathing, I used to
dry myself with the towel, and then put it out to dry. I used to
guard it carefully so that no one else would know about it.
One day a mischievous little boy saw when I was drying it,
and said, ‘Swami, Swami, this towel is required by the
Governor. He has asked me to get it from you. Please give it
to me.’ So saying he mischievously stretched out his hand.
‘Oh, dear! This towel! No, I cannot give it. Go away!’ I said.
“As that towel gradually got torn more and more with a
thousand holes in it, I ceased to keep it with me lest it should
be seen by Sesha Iyer and others. I used it after my bath,
and then after drying it, hid it in a hole in the trunk of a tree
within the temple precincts. One day, when I went out
somewhere, Sesha Iyer and others, while searching for
something else, happened to search that hole in the tree
trunk, and found the towel. Seeing its condition and blaming
themselves for their neglect, they began offering profuse
apologies when I returned. ‘What is the matter?’ I asked. ‘Is
it this towel with a thousand holes that you are daily drying
your body with after your bath? Shame on our devotion to
you! We could not find out even this.’ So saying, they brought
several bundles of towels."
-----------------------------------
continued...
I am no expert. But I do remember when the commission questioned Maharshi he said that he did not condone or stop people from taking donations for the ashram. That is in Talks. He said (I believe, I read it a while ago) that it was futile of him to stop people from doing what they were going to do anyway. Not only that, I don't know the details but funds were I believe collected for the mother's shrine. My point earlier, and I have no idea whether this is true, or whether anything is true, is that the mind will look for 'facts' to say this person is a jnani or an ajnani. When the jnani transcends 'facts', being completley outside of time and space. And so that to use some anecdotal or statistical or what have you evidence, or even saying well this jnani acted this way, other jnanis will act that way, I believe that is not guaranteed to work. In one of the David Godman interviews he mentioned that people lost faith in Papaji because Papaji had an affair outside of his marriage with a much younger woman and had a baby. I don't know the facts on it. But it seems pretty obvious to me that Papaji was fully realized in the Self. And in my case, I believed the gossip about the sage that I have pretty much unequivocally at this point accepted as a sat-guru. But the grace, and the perfection of his guidance beyond suffering and problems to transcendent harmonious Bliss, the skill with which he is able to bring me to that, and probably even deep states, maybe even samadhi, definitely effulgent states, the facts ceased to have any meaning to me. And then when I heard the contrary point of view. I'm like probably true, but doesn't matter. I don't think any ajnani is capable of htat kind of guidance. Thus, acceptance as a sat-guru. Everyone has there idea of what a sage looks like, how many people saw the Maharshi and said, "guy in loin cloth cutting onions, not interested". It seems to me that, collects donations could be another of the mind's many reasons. Because the mind cannot see a sage. The mind will always only see a physical person. Even if it isn't a physical person. That is probably why Maharshi gave a more failsafe key to guaging. The peace you feel, and the respect you have. I think with those you can't go wrong. Of course you can't decide that froma distance. I can't watch a youtube clip, and go "charlatan", because I don't feel peace. I could most definitely be wrong. Around my sat-guru, I felt complete dissolution of egoity, where I became everything and was completely stilled in peace and Bliss, nothing left over. Out of the corner of his eye he smiled at me. I'd be a fool to doubt.
Friends,
'Letters From Ramanasramam' continued:
“Something else also happened before this. My kowpinam
(small piece of cloth, usually a small strip, worn over the
privities) got torn. I do not usually ask anyone for anything.
Bodily privacy has however to be maintained. Where could
I get a needle and thread available to mend the kowpinam?
At last, I got hold of a thorn, made a hole in it, took out a
thread from the kowpinam itself, put it into the hole and thus
mended the cloth, and, so as to hide the place where it was
mended, I used to fold it suitably before putting it on. Time
passed like that. What do we need? Such were those days!”
said Bhagavan.
It was quite natural for him to tell us all this but we who
heard him felt deeply grieved. Having heard this incident
from Bhagavan some time back, Muruganar is reported to
have written a verse. The purport of that verse is:
“Oh, Venkata Ramana, who wore a kowpinam mended
by a thorn, and who was served by Indra as a towel with a
thousand eyes.”(Indra,King of Devas, is supposed to have Thousand Eyes-Eye or seeing objects -Refers to a Measure of Sense Enjoyment and Indra with a Thousand Eyes Refers to Sense Enjoyment of That Magnitude!)
Truly The Life that Sri Bhagavan lived is a Gold Reference.
This is what Sri Annamalai Swami said about Sri Bhagavan-Siddha of Siddhas!
Namaskar.
not sure if you are okay with me posting this here David, but 3 pieces of beautiful music of an uplifting nature, that I often listen to, i wondered if others might also enjoy them
Peter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfdpR7w7l5E&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kY2k0JcfByg&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fnavita.wordpress.com%2F&feature=player_embedded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0XewJKYPVn4
.
... Anonymous; If he was honest he would have said it's simply a "grab for cash" ...
I'm afraid that the spirit of this kind of spiritual scene is far more perverse, even psychologically malicious! People which don't like to pay money are sometimes accused of being "irresponsible" or kind of a "scrounger". A friend of mine was given a lecture about the evils of "taking and not giving".
This masters apparently don't understand that the "spirit of money" will inevitably penetrate in one way or another all the things one has to pay for.
... Perhaps the only thing to do in this circus atmosphere is to 'keep quiet' ...
That's really true. Therefore I will now stop my complaints.
.
Friends,
Here is another excerpt from 'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam':
22nd May, 1949
(244) SAMADARSATVAM!
(EQUALITY)
The Mandalabhishekam was performed in Mathrubhuteswara
temple on Vaisakha Suddha Chathurthi, i.e.,
Monday the 2nd May, 1949. Mahapuja (the Anniversary of
the death of Bhagavan’s Mother) was performed yesterday,
Vaishakha Bahula Navami. By that time, the erection of the
front hall of the temple had almost been completed. Hence
the Sarvadhikari consulted his assistants and requested
Bhagavan to stay in the front hall on those two days.
Accordingly on the afternoon of the 20th, Bhagavan came
there. That day I happened to be there a little earlier than
usual. When I went in by the main gate there was an
uncommon activity in the front hall. I went to the verandah
eagerly and found that Bhagavan was seated on the sofa. His
face was not radiant as usual. I was wondering why it was so. I
could not ask anybody.
The Sarvadhikari was standing opposite Bhagavan’s sofa
with his friends and some important people amongst Ashram
workers and was saying something. Bhagavan was merely
saying ‘Yes, yes,’ in a noncommittal manner. I hesitated to
go in under those circumstances and so stood in the
verandah. Bhagavan had noticed through the window my
coming and my hesitation to enter the hall. Ten minutes
elapsed by the time all of them left. Subsequently Sivanandam
alone was there near Bhagavan. Two or three people who
had recently arrived were seated at a distance. Bhagavan
was looking intently at the ceiling of the hall and at the huge
stones that were being chiselled outside. I went in, prostrated
and got up. Bhagavan looked at me and with a voice full of
kindness, said, “Do you see this? They have imprisoned me
within these four walls. They have made me a prisoner by
preventing other people from coming in. Look! There is no
scope for anyone to come in.” So saying, he looked up at the
ceiling, which had no outlet or inlet any where and said,
“How can they (the squirrels) come here?” He continued to
stare at the ceiling. I stood absolutely dumbfounded on
realising his way of looking at things. Sivanandam, who was
close by, said, “The Sarvadhikari and others feel that if
Bhagavan is here he will be protected from rain or hot
sunshine outside.” Bhagavan whose look was concentrated
on the ceiling, came to with a start when he heard those
words and looking at Sivanandam, said, “That’s all right. If
we look to our comfort, is it not at the expense of the
sufferings of others? Squirrels, monkeys, peacocks, cows and
others have no chance of coming here. Does it not mean
that we have deprived them all of their privileges? People
think that it is a great happiness for Swami if he is here.
What is to be done?” Bhagavan’s voice became tremulous.
The attendant took up the thread of the conversation and
said, “Yes, that is true. Only human beings can come in;
animals and birds cannot come in freely.” Bhagavan did not
say anything."
Continued....
Friends,
'Letters from Sri Ramansramam' continued....
"After sometime, some rich devotees came and sat opposite
Bhagavan. One or two poor people came after them but were
afraid to come in. Noticing this through the windows,
Bhagavan said to his attendants, “There you are. Look at those
people. You said there was every convenience for men to come
in. Is there scope for all people to come in? Rich people are
accustomed to see huge buildings with lights, fans, collapsible
doors and other imposing furnishings, and so they come inside
unhesitatingly. But poor people like me will hesitate to come
in, for they feel that it is a place where only rich people live.
They are afraid of what people would say if they come in, and
so, go away quietly like those people who, as you see, are
peeping through the windows. Where is the place for them
here? See those poor people! What a pity!” Unable to say
anything further Bhagavan resumed silence.
As soon as it was evening, he sent away some of his
attendants saying that the evening was the time when all of
them (monkeys, peacocks, etc.) come here. “They may
perhaps think that Swami has given them the slip and gone
elsewhere. Please go. What a pity! Go, give them at least
some food and come back.” As soon as the attendants
returned after feeding them, Bhagavan remarked with a
tremulous voice, “Have you fed them all? They will perhaps
feel that Swami has deserted them and has gone away to a
better place and is sitting there so that he alone can be happy.
Perhaps they thought that I had forgotten them. There is no
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 578
scope for them to come here. What to do?” Whenever any
animals or birds come to him, he would always say, “We do
not know who they are,” and would never look at them with
indifference. If any of the attendants do not give them proper
attention he would not tolerate it, but would say, “That is
bad. You merely see the skin that covers the body but not
the person that is within. You feel that you are great, and
the others are small, and so try to drive them away. They
have come here just as we have come. Why do they not have
the same rights that we have?” He used to admonish them
thus. It is not surprising that Bhagavan feels compassionate
towards the animals and the poor who do not venture to
come into this new hall with all these lights, fans, iron doors,
guards and other paraphernalia. You see, samadarsatvam, i.e.,
looking at all living beings with equality, is but natural to
Bhagavan."
-----------------------------------
Sri Bhagavan is incomparable.He is Love Incarnate.
Namaskar.
peter,
Neem Karoli baba was indeed a great soul and a very interesting one at that!
The music over there is Hanuman Chalisa sung by a westerner!(The First one)
You may like to visit this site to read about Swami Chidananda's experience with the Baba.
http://www.dlshq.org/saints/neemkaroli.htm
Namaskar.
It seems like if someone is selling snake oil in the name of Advaita Vedanta, or the name of Maharshi. It is completely irrelevent to the Self and my practice. Especially if I already can tell it is snake oil. It would just go to show that those people who are supposedly doing it for the wrong reasons, are more tamasic, nad have not transcended wordly need, the kind that makes people perpetrators of all sorts of things. The only thing that matters in this life is who and what is a help to being free. The things that do not help are irrelvent, not eternal and can be disregarded as unreal. This includes 'bad people', 'charlatans', but also my own 'personal problems'. I believe Maharshi said and helpfully, "correcting oneself is correcting the world". Who is to say that I am not a charlatan? Or not more of a charlatan then those people who i think are charlatans? Not to mention if I'm wrong. Yes, if I go to someone who is an abuser, and start feeling anxious, worse, with a hurt self-esteem. That is not someone who is helping me to get free. I strive not to get caught up in though gossiping about others which is too easy for me to do, and is a detrement to the aforementioned spiritual freedom. Something I have really struggled lately with is anger and judgement toward others, everything from administrators, police, of course arrogant spiritual seekers. But they do not exist outside of my mind, and my continually conjuring problems for myself does not help me get free.
Hi Ravi, Neem Karoli Baba stories
are wonderful. They are somehow thrilling.
Hi Ravi, Ramana Maharshi loved animals, trees, simply everything (a tree is a standing man) all one without a second.
Lakshmi the cow shed tears at the feet of Ramana. Ramana built a cowshed for Lakshmi and stated merit would be accrued through this deed.
Friends,
'Charlatans' pretending to be 'Gnani'is a very Familiar theme.How about a 'Gnani' trying to hoodwink others!The following excerpt from 'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam' is quite interesting-A Great lesson as well.
"8th December, 1949
(261) DECEPTIVE APPEARANCES
One afternoon in 1944, when devotees were conversing
about sundry matters in Bhagavan’s presence, the topic of
deceptive appearances and talks came up for discussion.
Addressing Bhagavan, a devotee said, “Some people put on
all sorts of false appearances to deceive the world.”
Bhagavan said, “Yes. Not some, but many. What of that?
If people put on false appearances, it is their own minds
that get troubled ultimately. They begin to be afraid of what
others would think of them and so their minds become their
own enemies. If people think of deceiving others by putting
on false appearances they themselves get deceived ultimately.
They think, ‘We have planned and have deceived others and
thereby have shown great cleverness.’ With pride they
practise more and more deceptions. The consequences of
their actions will be realised only when the deceptions are
discovered. When the time comes, they will collapse as a
result of their own deceits.”
While all were wondering whom Bhagavan had in mind,
Yogi Ramiah said, “Swami, this reminds me of an incident. I
remember to have read somewhere that Bhagavan had once
put on Panganamam.* Is it true?”
* Panganamam is the distinctive caste mark of a Vaishnavaite.
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 631
Bhagavan replied as follows: “Yes. That was during the
early days of my life on the hill. At that time some
Vaishnavaites used to come to me, and at their pressing
request I used to put on the namam, having nothing to lose
thereby. Not only that. Do you know what I did once? Those
were days when a Kalyana Mandapam was constructed in
Arunachaleswara Temple. It was Navaratri time. (Dasara
Festival). A bhajana troupe had arranged in the temple a
display of dolls for worship. They pressed me to go with
them to see the display. As I was afraid that somebody might
recognise me and start doing all sort of services, I put on a
dhoti of Palaniswami’s and covered my body with another
cloth, put on a namam like a Vaishnavaite and went with
them. The administrators of the temple knew me well. I
wanted to avoid them. They however recognised me at the
gate itself, and came after me saying, ‘Swami! Swami! You
also have come here to see the Swami? You yourself are a
Swami, aren’t you?’ What to do? I felt I was deceiving myself.
I somehow managed to evade them and get inside but I felt
that everyone was looking at me only. I did not see the
Mandapam nor could I see anything else. I turned back
intending to return unnoticed but the chief amongst the
archakas (priest) caught me again at the gate. ‘Swami! Swami!
You have come in this dress? Aha! How nice it is, Swami!
Please wait.’ So saying he stopped me, and addressing his
assistants, he said, ‘You fellow! bring a garland of flowers;
bring sandal paste; bring prasadam. Our Brahmanaswami has
come here putting on the dress of Lord Sri Krishna. It is
our great luck.’ So saying, they began to shower temple
honours on me. I somehow managed to escape their
attentions and went away. Later on, I tried a number of times
to hoodwink them and somehow go to the temple but
invariably they used to recognise me and give me all the
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 632
temple honours. Thereupon I gave up all further attempts
and stopped going to the temple altogether. It is the same
with everything. You can stay anywhere without fear, if you
are in your real form. If you put on a dress to deceive others,
you will be afraid every minute that someone might catch
you at your deception and so your mind becomes your own
enemy and troubles you,” said Bhagavan.
-----------------------------------
Sri Bhagavan is inimitable.Every act of his is full of sweetness and interesting.Reading 'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam' is Bhagavatam parayanam.
Namaskar.
Friends,
Ever heard of Advaitic Eating!The following excerpt from 'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam' is typical of Sri Bhagavan's utterly simple way of Living:
Devotee: “Are not horseradish (mullangi) and drumsticks
also forbidden for sadhakas?”
Bhagavan: “Yes. Watermelon, horseradish, drumsticks,
onions and other similar vegetables are forbidden. The mind
will be clear and pure depending on the sort of food one
eats, sattvic or otherwise. If one overeats sambar, soup and
boiled vegetables one will have to belch ‘Ho Ho’ and ‘Ha Ha’
and get worried over digesting it. If, however, one eats sattvic
food with only one side dish, one digests it easily and will be
happy. Who pays attention to such advice?”
Devotee: “Why do they not pay attention to such advice?
It is rather strange.”
Bhagavan: “That is a fact. Nobody heeds such advice.
Everyone says he must bring for Bhagavan laddoos and jilebis
(sweetmeats) but no one says rice and pepper water are better
for Bhagavan. They bring them all for Swami. But why does
Swami require all these things? Dandapani Swami was here
long back. At that time the method of cooking itself was
different. A big vessel used to be put on the fire. Whatever
vegetables were received till noon used to be cut and put
into it, boiled and sambar made. There was no ladle even to
stir and mix them. We used to take a piece of firewood, chisel
it and use it for stirring those vegetables in the vessel. That
preparation was the only side dish. When we mixed it with
rice and ate, it used to be very tasty. The labour also was
comparatively less. After cooking in the Ashram grew in size,
cooks had to be appointed. They used to consult me in the
early days about what to cook. I used to ask them, ‘Do you
have rice?’ and their reply was, ‘yes’. ‘Do you have water?’
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 528
‘Yes’. ‘Do you have salt?’ ‘Yes’. ‘Do you have pickles?’ ‘Yes.’
‘Buttermilk?’ ‘Yes.’ ‘ If so, what else do you want?’ I used to
say. After that, they ceased to ask me and now they merely
tell me, ‘We will cook this and we will cook that,’ and I say,
‘Yes, yes.’ I also advise them suitably. What do I lose? I do
not, however, give up my own custom, but mix all the side
dishes into one before taking them. When several people
gather together, they must have their way. Why should they
suffer on my account?”
-----------------------------------
What a lesson in melody and Harmony in Life!
Namaskar.
Ravi, that is a good story!
Friends,
Here is Sri Bhagavan trying to hoodwink again!(in local parlance, in tamil,putting a NAAMAM ON SOMEONE means hoodwinking that person!)Sri Bhagavan wrote a verse on VISHNU(and acknowledging grudgingly as if he had done it at the instance of Muruganar!We need to remember that he wrote Upadesa Undiyaar in identical circumstances!).Here is that excerpt from 'Letters from Sriramanasramam':
27th July, 1948
(198) FAITH
This morning at 8 o’clock one of the ardent devotees
brought the Tamil note book written by Bhagavan and gave
it to him. Bhagavan showed the verses he required, turned
over some of the pages, showed some more verses and
explained their meaning. I could not hear him and so looked
at him enquiringly. Noticing it Bhagavan said loudly, “Some
time ago, Muruganar wrote two verses in Tamil in praise of
Vishnu. One is a Kayikam (pertaining to the body) and the
other is a Vachikam (pertaining to the word of mouth). The
gist of those verses is:
‘1. Swami, you took the Varaha Avatar (The Boar
Incarnation), lifted the earth which was submerged in water
and saved the people. How could I, one of the inhabitants of
the earth, praise you suitably for the great good you have
done me?’
‘2. The world was one great ocean (Ekarnavam) when
the devatas prayed to you to save them. You then took the
shape of a hamsa (swan) and when with both wings fanned
the water, the water gave way and the earth came out of it.
For what you have done for us, how can I sufficiently praise
you?’
“This is the purport.
“After writing those two verses he insisted on my writing
the third one Manasikam (pertaining to the mind). So I could
not help writing it. It was only then that I wrote the verse,
the purport of which is:
‘O Swami, to relieve the burden of the earth, you took
the avatar of Krishna and by your teaching through the Gita,
like, “whenever there is decline of righteousness,” “for the
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 455
protection of the virtuous”* you assured us that you would
have several other incarnations. To praise such a Lord and
his various forms, who am I?’
“These words of praise or ‘Who am I?’ have several
meanings and could be interpreted in different ways by
different people. I wrote this verse on Vishnu mainly on
Muruganar’s insistence. He wrote Kayikam and Vachikam and
said that Bhagavan alone should write the Manasikam. What
could I do?”
I said, “Who else could possibly write the Manasikam?”
Looking at a gentleman sitting opposite, Bhagavan said,
“Look, that Krishnaswami Iyer wrote a commentary on
Bhagavad Gita, attached a picture of Krishna on the front
page of the manuscript and pressed me to write something
underneath. Then I wrote the verse ‘Parthan Therinal’ (in
Tamil) and then changed it into a sloka in Sanskrit......
As the Charioteer of Partha (Arjuna), the Lord gave him
the divine teaching. May He, who is compassion incarnate
and who resolved the distress of Arjuna, protect us!
“It is found in Bhagavad Gita Ratnamalika. These are
the only two I have written in praise of Vishnu and I had to
write them under the above circumstances.”
-----------------------------------
'Who am I'?-Sri Bhagavan seems to be saying that 'I am That Vishnu' as 'I am Siva' as well!Hari(vishnu) and Hara (siva) are one.
A clear case of Sri Bhagavan attempting to put a Naamam,this time on others, for a change!We have already seen how the temple headpriest worshipped him as Lord Sri Krishna and we need not be hoodwinked by sri Bhagavan's deceit.
We only recall what sri Bhagavan wrote -ARIYAADI IDARA JEEVARADU AGAVAARISA GUHAIYIL(in response to Amrithanatha who asked 'who is Ramana'?)-
œArunachala Ramana is the Paramatma
Himself who plays about as Consciousness in the hearts of
all living beings, from HARI downwards. He is the Supreme
Being. It will be clear to you if you open the eye of jnana and
see the truth!
As I am keying in this ,the CD player starts playing this very song!
Namaskar.
I was referring to Ravi's first story about Bhagavan in disguise. This one is good too. i was thinking one thing that clues analytical me into that Ravi has a deep understanding is the kinds of stories he picks. Melody and harmony. All day I've been immersed in melody and harmony. And I really think that is much closer to the Self. Or maybe is the Self, if I could uproot all the vasanas that ever take me out of melody and harmony, i would Realize what is to be Realized. my teacher responded when I asked about creativity that one of the many definitions of the Self is satayam-sivam-sundaram. I think I already posted that letter in thsi thread. It means true, good and beautiful. It makes sense love and Bliss either internal, or about something external the love and Bliss is the Self, while the object may be transient. Almost seems like you can use that as a barometer for judging, or discerning whether something is of the Self, or of the non-Self. All the things that cause suffering are of the non-Self, and in this teaching ultimately unreal. It almost seems like inquiry could be disregarding or dissolving the blemish in the total Bliss. But then I remember my teacher saying that this teaching points to something far vaster then the resolution of personal problems. So maybe the point isn't to interminably discern, but also completely merge in the Bliss, to quote the Ribhu Gita "like a solute such as cumin seed dissolved in water" ever abiding in unwavering Bliss. It almost seems like this teaching a key element is that Bliss is real and is alone Real. There is no valid cause for suffering. There is no real world, with real causes to be unhappy. And maybe the Bliss can then swallow the ego when that is realized.
"Hi Ravi, Neem Karoli Baba stories
are wonderful. They are somehow thrilling."
It seems like there is not a jnani that does not elicit that feeling of this person is totally thrilling. I feel that with papaji, and maharshi, my teacher, neem karoli baba, the little I've looked seems intensely thrilling. Nisargadatta. Aberham Lincoln, Marcus Aurelius, the buddha.
this is a satsang with papaji. In google video if you type in papaji avi, there are full over an hour long papaji satsangs straight, and i think they are more profound when you can watch a whole satsang. But this one in particular really gets me, with the Om symbol above him. The experience is the same as I had with my teacher, because as he talks, all the different misidentificiations fall off, and then effulgent Bliss reveals itself, and then in my vision everything starts shimmering white.
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=Papaji&hl=en&emb=0&aq=f#q=Papaji+avi&hl=en&view=2&emb=0
Friends,
""Hi Ravi, Neem Karoli Baba stories
are wonderful. They are somehow thrilling."
It seems like there is not a jnani that does not elicit that feeling of this person is totally thrilling. "
What peter and scott have expressed is something of a Refrain that occurs over and over again.
The utter Nonchalance that underscores these incidents is what is charming;It highlights the role of Providence-how Providence takes care of the one who has surrendered.
The Following Excerpt from 'Letters From Sri Ramanasramam' brings out this aspect:
6th August, 1946
(54) PURE BHAKTI (DEVOTION) IS
REAL SERVICE
Today a devotee asked Bhagavan: “Swami, what is that
story about myrobalams while you were on the hill?”
Bhagavan told us the following: “While I was in Virupaksha
Cave, I used to eat one myrobalam every night to move the
bowels freely. Once it so happened that there were none in
stock. As Palaniswamy was thinking of going to the bazaar, I
asked him to tell Sesha Iyer to send some myrobalams. He
said he would do so as Sesha Iyer was on his way to the
bazaar. The very next moment a devotee came from his
village. He used to visit our place now and then. After staying
with us for a while, he went out. A little later, Palaniswamy
started to go to the bazaar. In the meantime, the devotee
who had gone out, returned and said, ‘Swami, do you want
some myrobalams?’ ‘Give me one or two if you have them’
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 92
I said. He brought a big bag and placed it opposite to me.
When I asked him, ‘Where are all these from?’, he replied,
‘Swami, after having your darshan, I went out in a cart to a
village nearby as I had some work there. Another cart had
gone ahead of me laden with bags of myrobalams. One of
the bags had a hole from which these myrobalams fell out. I
picked them up and brought them here thinking that they
might be of some use. Let them be here, Swami.’ I took
about two or three viss and returned the rest to him. Such
things used to happen often. How many could we recollect!
When mother came and started cooking, she used to say
that it would be good if there was an iron ladle. I would say,
let us see. The next day or the day after that someone would
bring five or six ladles. It was the same thing with cooking
utensils. Mother would say that it would be good if we had
this or that article, and I would reply, ‘Is that so?’ and the
same day or the next, such articles, ten instead of one, used
to be received. Enough, enough of this I felt! Who is to look
after them? There were many such incidents,” said
Bhagavan.
continued....
Friends,
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam continued....
"“What about the grapes?” asked the devotee.
Bhagavan replied, “Yes, they also were being used for the
same purpose as the myrobalams. One day the stock of
grapes was exhausted. Palaniswamy wanted to know if he
could tell some one going to the shop to get them. I said
that there was no hurry, and that he should not worry
about it but should wait and see. That was all. Within a
short time, the brother of Gambhiram Seshayya came
there. There was a big packet in his hand. When asked
what it contained, he said, ‘grapes.’ ‘What! Just a little
while ago, we were saying that our stock had run out.
How did you come to know about it?’ I asked. He said,
‘How could I know about it, Swami? Before coming here,
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 93
I felt that I should not come to you with empty hands,
and so went to the bazaar. As it was Sunday, all the shops
but one were closed. ‘I am going to Bhagavan. What have
you got?’ I asked the shopkeeper. He said he had only
grapes and that too they had just arrived. So he packed
them and gave them to me. I brought them. It is only just
a while ago, Swami, that this thought occurred to me.’ On
comparing notes, it was found that the time coincided.
That was a very common experience for Ayyaswami also.
We used to think that it would be better if we had a certain
article, and at the very same hour, he used to feel that
that article should be taken to Bhagavan. If we asked him,
‘how did you know about it?’ Ayyaswami used to say,
‘Swami, how could I know? It merely occurred to me that
I should take a particular article to Bhagavan. I brought
it and that is all. You say that you were thinking of the
very same article at the time. Swami alone should know
about such strange happenings.’ Really, he used to keep
his mind pure, and so whatever we thought about here
used to mirror itself in his mind.”
Are we to be told specifically that we should keep our
minds pure and without blemish? The life of Ayyaswami itself
is an example of this, is it not?"
-----------------------------------
As Thayumanavar in one of his wreaths says:
When Sukha
Who was of Thy very Form bodily,
was called(By his Father Vyasa who ran after him-ravi),
Thou through all nature answered
''Why, why?''
Why was it?"
Oh Para Param!
The Sage Suka Brahmam was a Brahma Jnani by birth and roamed about Naked(Nirvanam also means Naked-That is why Thayumanavar describes him 'Who was of Thy very Form bodily ').The Story goes that Vyasa went after Suka calling him by name(when Suka left the Asramam of Vyasa);As Suka was steeped in Brahmic Consciousness,it seems that the all the leaves of the trees around that place answered Vyasa ''Why, why?''(As if to ask -What is the matter!What do you want?).
In like manner,Sri Bhagavan's needs(or his mother's) were met by Providence.
Namaskar.
Scott/Friends,
Thanks for that link.Watching the video clip 'Show me myself' somehow gives me the impression of an 'influence',something imposed from outside-Sri Bhagavan used to say-'What is gained will be lost.What is Truly yours will forever be yours'.
This somehow gives me the impression of a Fast food joint-These are the days of Fast Food-Fast Internet,Fast Flights,Fast Everything.Why not Fast Enlightenment!
I have not checked out the other videos on this site.May be that they are quite different than this one.
Namaskar.
Oh Ravi, the clip was the first one on the list, Just be quiet avi. It is a full over an hour long satsang video with Papaji. I was saying the whole Papaji satsang has a pretty profound impact. Yeah, the other clip you were mentioning is shorter called door to yourself. I haven't watched that one in a while, but pretty much any clip of Papaji is wortwhile. I really like the one Papaji surrender. As for the internet, any means possible, that's my feeling on it.
After a very very long time, I felt like playing the Vishnu Sahasranamam(1000 names of Vishnu). While it was playing, I opened the blog and was pleasantly surprised to find Ravi's comment on Bhagavan's verses on Vishnu. Strange coincidence indeed!
Scott,
Thanks very much;I will watch the ones that you have referred-the first one as well as the one on papaji surrender.
Strange as it may seem,i was in Kanpur from 1983-1987 which was only about 40 Kilometres from Lucknow where papaji lived.Again I was in Dehradun from 1987-1993;It was in 1993,when I was preparing to move to Chennai that in a small shop at Dehradun,I came across a small book of Papaji's conversations-'Wake up and Roar' with an Excellent introduction by Abhisiktananda -how he encountered 'Harilal'!
That was my introduction to Papaji-I read this book with interest and I 'thought' it was a Great Help in 'Focussing' on the 'Now'.I also made a 'Mental Note' that I should visit 'Poonjaji' sometime.
My next encounter with 'Poonjaji' was when after the passing away of Sri Annamalai Swami,his attendant and companion sri Sundaram told me about his trip to Lucknow-How he was taken care of by Poonjaji-how He dined everyday with Poonjaji-how Poonjaji was a Jnani,etc.Sundaram was feeling a little lost after the passing away of Sri Annamalai Swami and this trip to Lucknow had buoyed him up.
The Next time I met Sri Sundaram ,he informed me of the passing away of Poonjaji;he had at that time 'invited' one other 'Swami' -called 'Thiruvadi Thooli Swami'to sri Annamalai Swami Asramam and said that there are Readings of 'Kailvalya Navaneedham' ,Ribhu Gita,etc at the Asramam.Sundaram said 'After Swami's passing away,I looked up to Poonjaji.Now Poonjaji also has passed away;I feel the need for a Guru's Guidance.As a Godsend this 'Thiruvadi Thooli Swami' came and I have requested him to stay here.
The next that I heard was after a gap of few years-that Sri Annamalai Swami's Asramam was also attached to 'Sri Ramanasramam' and That 'Thiruvadi Thooli Swami' was shown the door(I heard from some other sources in Chennai that this swami was trying to 'misappropriate some funds' etc).
Recently when I had been to Sri Ramanasramam,I made enquiries about Sri Sundaram and was given to understand that he had moved to 'Nityananda Paramahansa' asramam.
-----------------------------------
Sorry for this digression;I have wondered how we go in search of Faroff places and we miss something in close proximity.I recall how I made that most sacred journey to Kamarpukur and Jayarambati,Birth place of Sri Ramakrishna and Holy Mother Sri Sarada Devi,away from Calcutta,taking a Rickety bus-and without any plan or arrangements!
Contrast this with how i was totally oblivious of 'Poonjaji' just a mere 40 Kms from where I lived in Kanpur.
-----------------------------------
I am reminded of Reading in one of David's interviews where he mentions how Sri Nisargadutta Maharaj suggested that Sri Ganesan
should 'Teach' at Sri Ramanasramam;also how Sri Ganesan turned down the offer of 'Realization' should he continue with him for a few days more!
I understand that these were just 'probings' by Maharaj to see the Depth of sri Ganesan's Faith in Sri Bhagavan.
Which sadhaka in right frame of mind would dare to 'Teach' in Sri Bhagavan's Presence!Which Sadhaka would be tempted for a 'Fast Food' elsewhere Ignoring the Rich Feast served at 'Home' by Sri Bhagavan.
I should say that Sri Ganesan Passed both these tests with flying colours!
As for Sundaram,his long association with swami will not go in vain.I wish him the very Best.
-----------------------------------
Namaskar.
Peter/Friends,
Peter mentioned the special relationship between Lakshmi,the cow and Sri Bhagavan.The samadhi of Lakshmi and the epitaph composed by Sri Bhagavan is a perennial source of inspiration-Of all the Devotees of sri Bhagavan it was given to Lakshmi alone the Privilege of close Proximity to the Old Hall.Along with Lakshmi,Valli the Deer,Jacki the Dog and the Blessed crow are the animal friends that enjoy this privilege.
Here is an Excerpt from 'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam':
3rd January, 1946
(20) A SQUIRREL
Do you know how much liberty our brother squirrel
has with Bhagavan? Two or three years back, there used to
be one very active and mischievous fellow amongst the
squirrels. One day it so happened that when he came for
food, Bhagavan was reading and otherwise occupied and so
delayed a bit in giving him food. That mischievous fellow
would not eat anything unless Bhagavan himself held it to
his mouth. Perhaps because of his anger at the delay he
abruptly bit Bhagavan’s finger, but Bhagavan still did not
offer him food. Bhagavan was amused and said, “You are a
naughty creature! You have bit my finger! I will no longer
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 35
feed you. Go away!” So saying he stopped feeding the squirrel
for some days.
Would that fellow stay quiet? No, he began begging of
Bhagavan for forgiveness by crawling hither and thither.
Bhagavan put the nuts on the window sill and on the sofa
and told him to help himself. But no, he wouldn’t even touch
them. Bhagavan pretended to be indifferent and not to notice.
But he would crawl up to Bhagavan’s legs, jump on his body,
climb on his shoulders and do ever so many things to attract
attention. Then Bhagavan told us all, “Look, this fellow is
begging me to forgive him his mischief in biting my finger
and to give up my refusal to feed him with my own hands.”
He pushed the squirrel away for some days saying,
“Naughty creature! Why did you bite my finger? I won’t
feed you now. That is your punishment. Look, the nuts are
there. Eat them all.” The squirrel would not give up his
obstinacy either. Some days passed and Bhagavan had finally
to admit defeat because of his mercy towards devotees. It
then occurred to me that it was through pertinacity that
devotees attained salvation.
That squirrel did not stop at that. He gathered together
a number of his gang and began building a nest in the roof
of the hall exactly above the sofa. They began squeezing
into the beam bits of string, coconut fibre and the like.
Whenever there was wind, those things used to fall down; so
people got angry and began to drive them away. Bhagavan
however used to feel very grieved at the thought that there
was not sufficient room for the squirrels to build a nest and
that the people in the hall were driving them away. We have
only to see Bhagavan’s face on such occasions to understand
the depth of his love and affection for such beings.
When I told Bhagavan that I had written to you about
the squirrels in my usual letter, he remarked with evident
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 36
pleasure: “There is a big story about these squirrels. Some
time back they used to have a nest near the beam above me.
They had children and then grand children and thus the
members of their family grew very large. They used to play
about on this sofa in whatever way they liked. When I went
out for my usual walk, some little squirrels used to hide under
the pillow and when on my return, I reclined on the pillow,
they used to get crushed. We could not bear the sight of this,
and so Madhava drove the squirrels out of the nest and sealed
it by nailing some wooden boards over it. There are lots of
incidents about them if one cared to write them.”
It is amazing how these animal friends had this sort of love for Sri Bhagavan.
Namaskar.
Friends, Never has there been so many advaitic teachers around, both in India and the west.
True awakening is very rare. "There is a false sense of liberation that aspirants reach that very few ever go beyond"
Ramana Maharshi when asked about spiritual teachers.
Who are these people with a false sense of liberation? It seems pretty obvious that if you still have vasanas and can suffer or have a definite idea of who you are, that is not freedom. I feel like Sri Bhagavan's message in saying this, is so that we don't get caught up in somethine less profound, not as an instruction to call out teachers and say they aren't really Realized.
Friends,
Scott mentioned about Sivam-Sundaram.Here is an excerpt from 'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam':
20th September, 1949
(256) SIVAM–SUNDARAM
(BLISS AND BEAUTY)
The wife of the Zamindar of Peddapavani, a frequent
visitor to the Ashram, came with her children last month.
She stayed for a month and went away a couple of days
ago. One evening, after Veda Parayana, she approached
Bhagavan and said, “Sometime back Bhagavan gave me
darshan in my dream and gave me upadesa. After that, I
realised my Self, but it is not steady. What should I do?”
Bhagavan: (amused) “Where has it gone without being
steady? Who is it that is not steady?”
Zamindarini: “That (realisation) is not steady.”
Bhagavan: “Where has it gone without being steady.”
Zamindarini: “That experience which I had does not
remain steady because of bodily ailment and family worries.”
Bhagavan: “I see. Say so. Those that come, come. Those
that go, go. We remain as we are.”
Zamindarini: “You must bestow on me the strength to
remain as I am.”
Bhagavan: “You have realised the Self, have you not? If
that is so, all the others disappear of their own accord.”
Zamindarini: “But they have not disappeared.”
Bhagavan (smiling): “I see. They will disappear. Vasanas
have for a long time built their nests within. If we realise
that they are there, they will disappear gradually.”
Zamindarini: “Bhagavan must bestow on me the
strength to make them disappear.”
Bhagavan: “We will see.”
The next day about the same time she stood humbly in
the presence of Bhagavan and said, “Bhagavan, it is not
possible for a married woman to stay on in the presence of
the Guru for any length of time, can she?”
Bhagavan: “The Guru is where one is.”
Zamindarini: (still unconvinced) “Should one look upon
the whole world as Brahman or should one look upon one’s
own Self as the most important?”
Bhagavan: “We exist. And the world is Brahman itself.
What then is there to look upon as Brahman?”
She was taken aback and stood still. Whereupon
Bhagavan looked at her compassionately and explained
further: “As you know we undoubtedly exist. The world also
exists as Brahman. That being so, what is there that one
could see as Brahman? We should make our vision as the
all-pervading Brahman. Ancients say, ‘Drishtim jnanamayim
kritva pasyeth brahmamayam jagat’. The world is as we see it. If
we see it as material, it is material. If we see it as Brahman, it
is Brahman. That is why we must change our outlook. Can
you see the picture in a film without the screen? If we remain
as we are, everything adjusts itself to that attitude.”
Overjoyed at this and fully satisfied, she came out and
sat on the step on the verandah which is opposite to
Bhagavan’s couch. Bhagavan was sitting on the couch in his
characteristic pose, silent as usual and with a smile on his
face. Looking at the radiant face of Bhagavan, she said
involuntarily, “Ah! How beautiful Bhagavan is!” A devotee
who heard the exclamation approached Bhagavan and said,
“She is saying how beautiful Bhagavan is.” With a slight nod
of his head Bhagavan said, “Sivam Sundaram”
See how
pregnant with meaning that expression is?
-----------------------------------
How this mother of children,with the responsibility of bringing them up and running the household,can aspire and attain the Highest goal of Life is a source of encouragement and inspiration for us.
Namaskar.
That is maybe one of the most beautiful (sundaram) Maharshi dialogues I've ever read. It did actually remind me of being in satsang in the presence of the spiritual teacher I correspond with. Where they would freeze me in this almost electrical awareness of the Bliss, and all the ritual around seemed almost perfect. There was something kind of slow in his response that would draw in my attention and then I usually would find that in his presence, I was right there as the same Self as he was. This of course is not easy to come to on my own. There it just seemed natural. When I was reading that dialogue, there were several responses of Bhagavan that reminded me exactly of my teacher's responses to me. Like the perfect statement to allay my fears. When he says "I see. What will come, comes. What goes, goes." That is the power of the Guru, to immediately, right then, silence the doubts of the devotee perfectly. And just reading it, it had that effect on me. Not only that, I was thinking of how my teacher, and this devotee that I believe is supposedly Realized named Cee, she gives satsang at some hermitage in Hawaii. Both of them, I've had from writing or getting responses from them in e-mail, them appearing in my dreams. Cee actually responded that if I do what my teacher says, I will know my true Self and not need letters from illusory others. And I felt that was somehow unsatisfying. In my dream I got an e-mail from her that night, and she said, "do not be superficial to fit in. And perform your studies with full vigor". Lakshmana Swami actually appeared in my dream, and on the telephone with him, he said, "you know, I never have the feeling that I have to defend myself" In all these dreams, the peace was so deep in the dream, that I believe these were manifestations of the Self.
This is my teacher's mandalas. Mandala Nine
Self-inquiry
The essential question,
The direct question,
The supreme question.
The inquiry yielding
Realization of the Self:
Who am I?
All questions are really
That question.
"Who am I?"
Ceaselessly inquire,
"Who am I?"
With full penetration,
And, thus, the Self
Is Self-revealed.
For one who constantly
Inquires to know the Self,
Every moment is
Certainly profound
Whatever the experience,
Be it subtle thought
Or sensed perception,
Then or now,
Here or there,
Of I or this,
For whom is it?
The way is nonobjective:
Who am I?
The essential question.
Inquire to know the Self,
Negating all
That is not the Self.
The body is
Not who you are
And not where you are.
The body is not the Self.
The senses are
Not who you are,
And you are not in their midst.
The senses are not the Self.
The prana is
Not who you are,
And you are not in it,
Nor is it really in you.
The prana is not the Self.
The mind is
Not who you are
And not where you are;
Nor is it really in you,
The mind is not the Self.
Never a thing or in a thing,
Never a thought or in an array of thoughts,
Not in anything and nothing in it,
Not gross, subtle, or causal,
Without creation, sustenance, or destruction,
That which remains after the negation of all else,
Inquire to know the Self.
The inquirer is the answer
To the inquiry into the Self.
There can be no other answer.
There can be no other answer.
There can be no other Self.
The SElf itself
Is the knower, the Knowledge,
And That which is to be known,
Free of division and triads.
When there is
No meditator,
No meditation,
And no object of meditation.
The meditation is complete.
One who ardently meditates,
Inwardly keenly aware,
With the meditation of inquiry,
"Who am I?"
Being absorbed in Truth,
Abiding in Truth as Truth,
The Truth of the Self,
Finds by inquiry that
The inquirer is the answer.
Adherence to the Truth of the SElf
With effort is spiritual practice.
Effortless abidance in the Truth of the Self
Is Self-REalization.
Self-inquiry eliminates "me."
With no "me,"
How can "mine" remain?
Surrender eliminates "mine."
With no "mine."
How can "me" survive?
Devotedly inquire,
Inquiring to know That
To which one is devoted,
Practice intensely
So that the true "I" is realized.
Practice until doubtless and boundless.
The End itself appears as the means.
Practice until effortless,
Natural and innate is the
Adherence to the Truth of the Self.
Friends,
This excerpt from 'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam' throws light on some of the points discussed in this Blog-What is the use of 'experiences',Whether 'Outer Renunciation' is necessary,etc.
25th February, 1947
(98) SELF (ATMAN)
This morning a Gujarati lady arrived from Bombay with
her husband and children. She was middle-aged, and from
her bearing she appeared to be a cultured lady. The husband
wore khaddar, and appeared to be a congressman. They seemed
to be respectable people by the way they conducted themselves.
They all gathered in the Hall by about 10 a.m., after finishing
their bath, etc. From their attitude it could be seen that they
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 198
intended to ask some questions. Within fifteen minutes or so
they began asking as follows:
Lady: Bhagavan! How can one attain the Self?
Bhagavan: Why should you attain the Self?
Lady: For shanti (peace).
Bhagavan: So! Is that it? Then there is what is called
peace, is there?
Lady: Yes! there is.
Bhagavan: All right! And you know that you should
attain it. How do you know? To know that, you must have
experienced it at some time or other. It is only when one
knows that sugarcane is sweet, that one wishes to have some.
Similarly, you must have experienced peace. You experience
it now and then. Otherwise, why this longing for peace? In
fact we find every human being is longing similarly for peace;
peace of some kind. It is therefore obvious that peace is the
real thing, the reality; call that ‘shanti’, ‘soul’, or ‘Paramatma’
or ‘Self ’ — whatever you like. We all want it, don’t we?
Lady: Yes! But how to attain it?
Bhagavan: What you have got is shanti itself. What can I
say if some one asks for something which he has already got? If
it is anything to be brought from somewhere, effort is required.
The mind with all its activities has come between you and your
Self. What you have to do now is to get rid of that.
Lady: Is living in seclusion necessary for sadhana, or is
it enough if we merely discard all worldly pleasures?
Bhagavan merely answered the second part of the question
by saying, “renunciation means internal renunciation and not
external,” and kept silent.
The dinner gong sounded from the dining hall.
What can Bhagavan reply to the earlier part of the last
question of this lady who has a large family? She is also educated
and cultured. Bhagavan used to speak similarly to householders;
and there is a ring of appropriateness about it. After all, is internal
or mental renunciation so easy as all that? That is why Bhagavan
merely replied that renunciation means internal renunciation
and not external. Perhaps the next question would have been,
“what is meant by ‘internal renunciation’?” and there would
have been a reply if the dinner gong had not intervened. I
returned to my abode where I live in seclusion. You see God
has allotted to each individual what is apt and appropriate.
Did Bhagavan ever ask me, “Why are you living alone?”
Or did he mention it to anybody else? Never. If you ask why,
it is because this is appropriate to the conditions of my life.
-----------------------------------
The Gujrati Lady was a householder and Suri Nagamma was leading a Life of an ashramite-This is providential.The Fundamental Problem is the same for all.
How often we encounter sadhakas who are on the lookout for more 'Favorable' external conditions to pursue sadhana more effectively.This is one big ILLUSION.The paradox is that if we pursue Sadhana effectively,the 'Favourable' situation is brought about!In other words -all circumstances become favourable!
Namaskar.
.
«There is a Realizable that you must comprehend with the flower of intuition, because if you direct your intuition toward it and you conceive it as something that is defined, you will not be able to grasp it. It is the power of an irradiating force that dazzles through intuitive realizations. It cannot be comprehended with vehemence, but with the subtle flame of a subtle intuition that measures everything but that Realizable; and you cannot comprehend it with intensity but tend toward It – directing the pure gaze of your detached soul – to realize It with “empty realization”, as It dwells outside intuition.» (C.O.)
***
«Only Contemplation is left, unexposed to magic...» (P)
***
«...Man... in this receptivity is Virgin.» (ME)
***
«Thus, where past and future coincide in the present, neither past nor future
exist...» (NC)
.
.
Abolish sageness and cast away knowledge, and the world will be brought to a state of great order
or
Both holiness and wordliness are like evils
Zhui Khu asked Lâo Tan, saying, 'If you do not govern the world, how can you make men's minds good?' The reply was, 'Take care how you meddle with and disturb men's minds. The mind, if pushed about, gets depressed; if helped forward, it gets exalted. Now exalted, now depressed, here it appears as a prisoner, and there as a wrathful fury. (At one time) it becomes pliable and soft, yielding to what is hard and strong; (at another), it is sharp as the sharpest corner, fit to carve or chisel (stone or jade). Now it is hot as a scorching fire, and anon it is cold as ice. It is so swift that while one is bending down and lifting up his head, it shall twice have put forth a soothing hand beyond the four seas. Resting, it is still as a deep abyss; moving, it is like one of the bodies in the sky; in its resolute haughtiness, it refuses to be bound; - such is the mind of man!'
[...]
In the present age those who have been put to death in various ways lie thick as if pillowed on each other; those who are wearing the cangue press on each other (on the roads); those who are suffering the bastinado can see each other (all over the land). And now the Literati and the Mohists begin to stand, on tiptoe and with bare arms, among the fettered and manacled crowd! Ah! extreme is their shamelessness, and their failure to see the disgrace! Strange that we should be slow to recognise their sageness and wisdom in the bars of the cangue, and their benevolence and righteousness in the rivets of the fetters and handcuffs! [...]
Therefore it is said, 'Abolish sageness and cast away knowledge, and the world will be brought to a state of great order.'
.
Mr.David Godman
Is the essay 'who am I?' in your homepage your translation from Tamil to English?
I found it is different from 'who am I?' in 'The collected works of ramana maharshi'.
The order of sentenses and translation of Bagavan's words are a little different.
If so, what is the equivalent word for 'SELF' in Tamil?
Is the word in Tamil used every day life in Tamil language like 'I 'in English or religious word? I want to know the nuance of the word.
Are the words which were not translated into English like 'dhatus, prana, atma, vishaya vasana etc' Sanskrit?
Shiba
Bhagvan sometimes used the Sanskrit term atma to denote the Self, even when he was speaking or writing in Tamil. For example:
'Remaining firmly in Self-abidance [atma-nishta] without giving even the least room to the rising of any thought other than the thought of Self [atma-chintanai] is surrendering oneself to God' (Who am I?)
In the next paragraph he uses the term atma-sukham to describe the nature of the Self as happiness.
Bhagavan would also often use the Tamil word 'taan' to denote the Self. This is similar to the English word 'self' in that the context determines whether it refers to the individual self or the transcendent one. In Ulladu Narpadu, verse four, for example, when Bhagavan says that the Self is the infinite eye, he uses the term 'taan' for Self. Taan is a common, non-technical word that is used frequently in Tamil.
The version of Who am I? you read on my site is, as you surmised, different from the version in Collected Works. It is based on one done by Sadhu Om. His version can be found as appendix one in all the editions of The Path of Sri Ramana, Part One.
And yes, the terms you queried are all Sanskrit words.
Hi Clemens, I get your interesting drift but ultimately one pointed effort is required, grace is needed and its mysterious. One can't grasp it with the mind and lord knows we're all top heavy.
Accept the mystery of it, as it's really all too obscure and inexplicable and yet it fascinates!
Shiba/Friends,
This excerpt from 'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam' deals with the Nature of Maya,Reality and Sadhana in a simple way:
21st May, 1947
(119) NIDIDHYASANA (INTENSE
CONCENTRATION)
Yesterday morning at 8 o’clock, Dr. Syed who is a worker
for Arya Vignana Sangha and one of the disciples of
Bhagavan, came here for Bhagavan’s darshan and asked,
“Bhagavan says the whole world is the swarupa of Atma. If
so, why do we find so many troubles in this world?”
With a face indicating pleasure, Bhagavan replied “That
is called Maya. In Vedanta Chintamani, that Maya has been
described in five ways. One by name Nijaguna Yogi wrote
that book in Canarese. Vedanta has been so well dealt with in
it, it can be said to be an authority on the Vedanta language.
There is a Tamil translation. The five names of Maya are, Tamas,
Maya, Moham, Avidya and Anitya. Tamas is that which hides the
knowledge of life. Maya is that which is responsible for making
one who is the form of the world appear different from it.
Moha is that which makes a different one look real: sukti rajata
bhranthi — creating an illusion that mother-of-pearl is made
of silver. Avidya is that which spoils Vidya (learning). Anitya is
transient, that which is different from what is permanent and
real. On account of these five Mayas troubles appear in the
Atma like the cinema pictures on the screen. Only to remove
this Maya it is said that the whole world is mithya (unreal).
Atman is like the screen. Just as you come to know that the
pictures that are shown are dependent on the screen and do
not exist otherwise, so also, until one is able to know by Selfenquiry
that the world that is visible is not different from Atma,
it has to be said that this is all mithya. But once the reality is
known, the whole universe will appear as Atma only. Hence
the very people who said the world is unreal, have subsequently
said that it is only Atma swarupa. After all, it is the outlook that
is important. If the outlook changes, the troubles of the world
will not worry us. Are the waves different from the ocean?
Why do the waves occur at all? If asked, what reply can we
give? The troubles in the world also are like that. Waves come
and go. If it is found out that they are not different from
Atma this worry will not exist.”
That devotee said in a plaintive tone, “However often
Bhagavan teaches us, we are not able to understand.”
“People say that they are not able to know the Atma that is
all-pervading. What can I do? Even the smallest child says,
‘I exist. I do; and this is mine’. So, everyone understands
that the thing ‘I’ is always existent. It is only when that ‘I’ is
there, the feeling is there that you are the body, he is
Venkanna, this is Ramanna and the like. To know that the
one that is always visible is one’s own self, is it necessary to
search with a candle? To say that we do not know the Atma
swarupa which is not different but which is in one’s own self
is like saying ‘I do not know myself ’,” said Bhagavan.
“That means that those who by sravana (hearing) and
manana (repeating within oneself) become enlightened and
look upon the whole visible world as full of Maya, will
ultimately find the real swarupa by nididhyasana,” said the
devotee.
“Yes, that is it. Nidi means swarupa; nididhyasana is the
act of intensely concentrating on the swarupa with the help
of sravana and manana of the words of the Guru. That means
to meditate on that with undeflected zeal. After meditating
for a long time, he merges in it. Then it shines as itself. That
is always there. There will be no troubles of this sort if one
can see the thing as it is. Why so many questions to see one’s
own self that is always there?” said Bhagavan.
Namaskar.
This was a clip of my teacher, that I really was kind of hit hard by, so I'll share it, in a spirit not of proseyltization, but just because I found it profound and kind of cool.
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=silent+self&hl=en&emb=0&aq=f#q=silent+self+part+3&hl=en&view=2&emb=0
If you do look at it. It's the first one on the list. I purposely picked part 3, because there was really good conversation between my teacher and several seekers. So Silent Self SAT satsang Part 3. Should be first on list. Especially it deals with the formation of opinions, which I think is something I struggle with, complacently forming opinions about others, when I even know that an opinion cannot encapsulate anything or anybody. Worse fear and anger that arise from those opinions. Maybe at some point from all this stuff, my ego will be sufficiently destroyed or (rendered) non-existent that I won't feel the need to excitedly show others what I find helpful. Who knows?
Excellent pick of dialogue, Ravi! That is very interesting, I've been having some very intense maya adventures the last year. It's interesting in my deepening, sometimes even my expectation creates a hallucenation of something occuring. Not like something that isn't there, but I'll see reactions in other people that are not infact occuring, it's like Maya explicit. I resonated with alot of what Maharshi is describing. I thought in the video I just posted, there was a smile indicating pleasure that my teacher gave that seemed very similar to the one described in that letter from Ramanasramam.
So interesting," Respectable people,and a cultured lady and her Congressman husband." I don't think Ramana would have been impressed with all that.
It is the unknown and humble Mastan
that Ramana Maharshi asked that a Samadhi be built for this castless
weaver. Not to mention the unassuming Akhilandamma. To read about these ripe souls is uplifting.
Hi David,
I left a complimentary copy of my novel for you in Ramanashram bookstall. It is a successul novel called 'The Storyteller'.
Hope you enjoy it.
www.arunachalaheart.blogspot.com
Part 6 was really good too. A really awesome anecdote about self-importance and some really good advise about self-inquiry, the part that really struck me, was how if the misidentifications that are causing thought and suffering are not dealt with or inquired into, inquiring into the I-thought is only a mental exercise.
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=silent+self&hl=en&emb=0&aq=f#q=silent+self+part+6&hl=en&view=2&emb=0
Friends,
An excerpt from 'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam':
8th February, 1947
(90) THE JNANI’S MIND IS BRAHMAN
ITSELF
I went to the Hall at about 7-30 this morning. It was all
silent inside. The aroma of the burning incense sticks coming
out of the windows indicated to the new visitors that Bhagavan
was there. I went inside, bowed before Bhagavan and then
sat down. Bhagavan, who was all along leaning on a pillow,
sat up erect in the Padmasana pose. In a moment his look
became motionless and transcendent and the whole hall was
filled with lustre. Suddenly someone asked, “Swamiji! Do
the Jnanis have a mind or not?”
Bhagavan cast a benevolent look at him, and said,
“There is no question of one realising Brahman without a
mind; realisation is possible only if there is a mind; mind
always functions with some upadhi (support); there is no mind
without upadhi; it is only in connection with the upadhi that
we say that one is a Jnani. Without the upadhi, how can one
say that some one is a Jnani? But how does the upadhi function
without mind? It does not; that is why it is said that the
Jnani’s mind itself is Brahman. The Jnani is always looking
at Brahman. How is it possible to see without a mind? That
is why it is said that the Jnani’s mind is Brahmakara and
akhandakara. But in reality his mind itself is Brahman. Just
as an ignorant man does not recognise Brahman within but
only recognises the external vrittis (things), so also though
the Jnani’s body moves about in the external vrittis, he always
recognises only the Brahman within. That Brahman is allpervading.
When once the mind is lost in the Brahman, to
call the mind Brahmakara is like saying that a river is like the
ocean; when once all the rivers get lost in the ocean, it is all
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 182
one vast sheet of water. Can you then distinguish in that vast
sheet of water, ‘This is the Ganges, this is the Goutami, this
river is so long, that river is so wide’, and so on? It is the
same with regard to the mind also.”
continued....
'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam' Continued....
"Someone else asked, “They say that satvam is Brahman,
and that rajas and tamas are abhasa; is that so?” Bhagavan
replied: “Yes! Sat is what exists; Sat is satvam; it is the natural
thing; it is the subtle movement of the mind. By its contacts
with rajas and tamas it creates the world with its innumerable
forms. It is only due to its contact with rajas and tamas that
the mind looks at the world which is abhasa, and gets deluded.
If you remove that contact, satva shines pure and
uncontaminated. That is called pure Satva or Suddhasatva.
This contact cannot be eliminated unless you enquire with
the subtlest of the subtle mind and reject it. All the vasanas
have to be subdued and the mind has to become very subtle;
that means, subtle among the subtlest — they say anoraneeyam
(atom within an atom). It should become atomic to the atom.
If it becomes subdued as an atom to the atom, then it rises to
the infinite among infinities, ‘mahato maheeyam’. Call it the
mind seeing, or the mind acquiring powers; call it whatever
you like. By whatever name it is called, when we sleep the
mind, with all its activities lies subdued in the heart. What
do we see then? Nothing. Why? Because the mind lies
subdued. We wake up from our sleep, and as soon as we
wake up there is mind, there is Sat and Brahman. As soon as
the mind that is awake is attached to the gunas, every activity
emerges. If you discard those guna vikaras, (vagaries of the
mind), the Brahman appears everywhere, self-luminous and
self-evident, the Aham, ‘I’. Then everything appears
thanmayam (all pervading). See the technical language of the
Vedanta: they say, Brahma-vid, (Brahman-knowing), Brahma
Vidvarishta, (supreme among the Brahman-knowing), and
Letters from Sri Ramanasramam 183
so on, and then they say, Brahmaiva Bhavati, (he becomes
Brahman itself). He is Brahman itself. That is why we say
that the jnani’s mind itself is Brahman.”
Someone else asked, “They say that the Jnani conducts
himself with absolute equality towards all?” Bhagavan replied,
“Yes! How does a Jnani conduct himself?”
Maitri (friendship), karuna (kindness), mudita (happiness)
and upeksha (indifference) and such other bhavas become
natural to them.
Affection towards the good, kindness
towards the helpless, happiness in doing good deeds,
forgiveness towards the wicked, all such things are natural
characteristics of the Jnani.
Patanjali Yoga Sutra, 1: 33
-----------------------------------
Namaskar.
Thank you for your reply, Mr.Godman.
It seems 'jnana' is Tamil, but 'jnana' is not often translated into 'knowledge' in English.
In tanslation, all Sanskrit words didn't remain as Sanskrit and all Tamil words didn't taranslated into English.
Except 'individual self' in the last section of 'who am I' in this site, I think there is no need to translate 'taan' into 'self' not into 'SELF'.
And is there paticular Tamil word which indicate 'individual' in original text? In 'collected works', it is expressed as 'one’s self'.
About 'prana',in 'collected works', all 'prana' seems to be translated into 'breath',but in 'who am I' in this site 'breath' and 'prana' is distinguished.
Did bhagavan distinguish 'prana' and 'breath'?
In the sentence 'these two are one and the same' in 'who am I' in this site, two are explained as 'non-attachment' and 'desirelessness', but I think two are 'non-attachiment or desirelessness' and 'jnana'.
Two sentences 'Not giving... and Not leaving ... ' are pralleled, so it seems natural for me to think so.
Thank you Ravi for your quotation.
This version is different from Q&A version. There is no such sentence 'these two are one and the same' in Q&A version.(neither in English nor Tamil version).
Where did this sentence come from?
Friends,
The Benefit of Satsangha is brought out in this Excerpt from 'Letters from Sri Ramanasramam':
20th October, 1948
(208) SADHU SANGAM
At 3 o’clock yesterday afternoon an elderly lady came to
Bhagavan along with her children, grandsons, granddaughters
and others. On seeing them, Bhagavan said with a smile, “Oh
Kanthi! Is that you? I thought it was somebody else.” She
went to Bhagavan with some familiarity, showed him all her
progeny, prostrated before him and came back to sit with the
ladies. Looking at me Bhagavan asked, “Do you know who
she is?” On my replying in the negative, he told us:
“There is in the town a gentleman called Seshachala
Iyer. She is his daughter. This lady, Echamma’s niece,
Chellamma, Rameswara Iyer’s daughter, Rajamma and some
others are all of about the same age. They were all quite
young when I was on the hill. They used to climb up the hill
and come to me very often. Sometimes they used even to
bring their dolls and perform the dolls’ marriages. At other
times they used to bring rice, dhal, etc., cook and eat and
give me also something from their preparations.”
“I take it, Bhagavan used to play with them?” I said.
“Yes. They used to come up whenever they felt like it. They
were all very young, you see, and so they were independent.
Now she has a big family and so she cannot come whenever
she wants to. As it is a long time since she came last, I was
wondering who it was,” said Bhagavan. “Not only did you
play marbles with the little boys but you played Gaccha Kayalu
(children’s game) with the little girls. They were all born
lucky,” I said. Nodding his head in affirmation, Bhagavan
related an incident that had occurred at that time.
“It was in those days that Chellamma came to me with
a paper in her hand. When I looked at it out of curiosity, I
found written on it the following sloka(Sanskrit)
"If association with sages is obtained, to what purpose are
the various methods of self-discipline? Tell me, of what
use is a fan when the cool, gentle south wind is blowing?"
“I translated it into Tamil in verse form beginning with
‘Sadhu sangathal’. Subsequently it was included in the
supplement to the “Forty Verses” (verse 3). You have it in
prose, have you not?” asked Bhagavan, and I replied in the
affirmative.
I asked, “How did Chellamma get that paper and why
did she bring it to you?” Bhagavan replied, “Echamma used
to fast every now and then, saying it was Ekadasi or it was
Krithikai and the like. Chellamma too started to fast with
Echamma. But then Chellamma was very young and used
to suffer a lot in consequence. Echamma usually sent food
for me through her. On a Krithikai day she brought me
food even though she was fasting that day. How could I eat
when she was not taking any food? I told her that she should
not indulge in such fasts being young, and somehow prevailed
upon her to eat. Next day while she was coming up the hill
with food she found that paper. It appeared to contain some
sloka and so she brought it with her to show it to me. When I
saw that, I found it contained this sloka. I said, ‘Look. It
contains the same thing I told you about yesterday.’ She asked
me what its meaning was and so I translated it into a verse in
Tamil and explained the meaning to her. Thereafter she gave
up her fasts. She had great faith in me. Even after she
attained age she never would write anything on paper without
the words ‘Sri Ramana’ to begin with. Those children used
to recite before me all the songs and verses they learnt. When
Chellamma passed away all of them felt as if they lost their
own sister,” said Bhagavan.
One devotee said, “It is stated in the Biography that
when the news of her death was announced, Bhagavan was
visibly moved and expressed sorrow. Is that a fact?”
Bhagavan said that it was a fact and was silent. You know,
Bhagavan has said several times that a Jnani weeps with those
who weep and laughs with those who laugh.
-----------------------------------
Namaskar
Shiba
Thanks for your queries.
Although 'jnana' is a Sanskrit word, it often appears in Tamil texts on vedanta and advaita. The Tamil word 'arivu' is sometimes used to denote the same concept in Tamil. At the beginning of Who am I?, for example, Bhagavan writes (Sadhu Om translation) 'the knowledge which remains alone, itself is "I". The nature of this knowledge is existence-consciousness-bliss.' In both sentences the word 'arivu' has been translated as 'knowledge'. When we came across the word 'arivu' in our Guru Vachaka Kovai translations, we usually translated it as 'consciousness'.
As I mentioned in an earlier reply, it usually the context which determines whether 'taan' is translated as 'individual self' or 'Self'. Often, one needs an understanding of Bhagavan's teachings, not just the language, to make the right pick. Take, for example, verse 19 0f Ulladu Narpadu:
The dispute as to which will triumph, fate or free-will, is only for those who are without understanding as to the root of fate and free-will. Those who have known the [ego] self, which is the single source of fate and free-will, are free from those things. Say, will they resort to them thereafter?
If you are not aware that Bhagavan teaches that fate and freewill are dependent on the existence of the ego, and not the real Self, then one might be tempted to leave out the ego in square brackets and capitalise the 's' in Self. There is nothing in the text itself to indicate which of the two is correct.
Again, at the beginning of verse 21, knowledge of the teaching is important in deciding whether taan should denote the individual or non-personal Self.
'If you ask what is the truth of the many learned works which speak of 'one's seeing oneself'...
Two variations of taan are used for 'one's' and 'oneself'. If one knows Bhagavan's teachings, one knows that the individual self can never 'see' the Self. It then becomes clear that the text is saying 'one's seeing oneself' and not 'One's seeing the Self'.
(Continued in the next post)
Shiba again
You wrote:
Except 'individual self' in the last section of 'who am I' in this site, I think there is no need to translate 'taan' into 'self' not into 'SELF'.
And is there particular Tamil word which indicate 'individual' in original text? In 'collected works', it is expressed as 'one’s self'.
I have just had a quick look at Who am I? again and I agree with you that almost all the instances of the word Self in the English version refer to the impersonal Self. Where there is some doubt, the matter is clarified and expanded on by Bhagavan. For example:
'If one goes on scrutinising the nature of the mind, it will finally be found that oneself alone is the mind. What is called 'oneself' [taan] is verily Self [atma-swarupam].' (Sadhu Om's translation)
'If one pursues the enquiry into the nature of the mind, that which will remain is only the self [that sought it]. That self [taan] is the Self, the atma swarupa.' (unpublished translation by Robert Butler)
As to whether there are qualifying words that determine whether taan refers to the individual or non-individual self, I explained in my previous post that it is primarily context that determines the correct translation.
With regard to prana, though it is sometimes translated as 'breath', this is not an accurate translation. Though prana and breath are related, prana can be better understood as an animating force that sustains the body. Prana is sometimes translated as 'vital air' or 'vital breath' to distinguish it from the gas that goes in and out of the lungs. Prana is absorbed through breathing, but it is more than the physical interaction between oxygen and the cilia of the lungs.
You also wrote:
In the sentence 'these two are one and the same' in 'who am I' in this site, two are explained as 'non-attachment' and 'desirelessness', but I think two are 'non-attachiment or desirelessness' and 'jnana'.
You are right on this one. The pairing should be desirelessness (nirasa)and true knowledge (jnana). Though it is not explicitly stated in the text, Bhagavan's comments on other occasions support this interpretation.
Akira
I have just checked the essay version and the question-and-answer version of Who am I? in both English and Tamil. The phrase 'they are the same' appears in all the versions. Check question twenty-six and the beginning of the answer in the versions you have consulted.
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Friends,
does someone here knows where to find the full text of:
Dattatreya - Jivanmukta Gheeta
in the net? I tried it but unsuccessful, at many places.
.
I have an odd request to make. I want to know all the statements/predictions the Maharshi made on the second world war and about national and world events in general.
Ramana seemed to know the outcome of the war long before the war ended:
This is an account given by G.V.Subbaramayya in "Sri Ramana Reminiscences" Page 77.
"It was June 10 1940. The radio announced the fall of Paris to Germany and the entry of Italy into the war against the allies. At about 3am, Sri Bhagavan, Sri Narayana Iyer and myself were at work in the grinding room. I had just heard a rumour that to counteract the action of Italy, Turkey had declared war on the side of the Allies. I asked Narayana Iyer, who was the latest arrival from the town whether he had heard any such announcement on the radio. Before Narayana Iyer could reply, Sri Bhagavan Himself said "No, it cannot be true". Narayana Iyer confirmed this rare reply of Sri Bhagavan, and turning to me, observed "France, a first rate Power has falling in three days. Then do you think our Britain can hold out longer than three weeks at the most?" Upon this, Sri Bhagavan observed "Um! - but Russia...". Abruptly Sri Bhagavan cut short his speech and resumed silence. Neither of us had the courage to ask Sri Bhagavan what Russia was going to do, though it appeared strange that Sri Bhagavan should mention Russia who was at that time friendly to Germany. It will be remebered that war broke out between Germany and Russia only one year afterwards, and it was in fact Germany's attack on Russia that turned the tide of fortune in favour of the Allies. Here was afforded a peep into the Omniscience of this seeming recluse who was suppoed to know nothing of the world"
This one's reported by Mercedes de Acosta:
He said, "There will be what will be called a 'war,' but which, in reality, will be a great world revolution. Every country and every person will be touched by it. You must return to America. Your destiny is not in India at this time."
Thank you, David. I understood. In Q&A version it is written 'Desirelessness is wisdom' as Shiba says.
P.S. I received two Annamalai Swami books you sent. Wonderful books. Thank you.
Ramos,
Please check this site:
http://www.thakor.freeserve.co.uk/jivan.htm
Namaskar.
I suddenly became kind of interested in karma more in depth. I was reading the glossary of the Ribhu Gita that was tranlsated by Ramamoorthy and Nome. It was talking about how there are 3 kinds of karma. Sanchita, agama and prarabdha. (I'm new to this, so I could have mixed them up) I thought sanchita was karma created in this life but won't take effect until a future life. Agama is karma created in this life that will take effect in this life. I was thinking I shoot someone, I get death penalty might be agama karma. Or I make people mad at me by doing something unrighteous and they harm me. Prarabdha is karma created in past lives that take effect in this life. And the sweeping arc of this life is prarabdha karma. Even aspects of the teaching like this one can be liberating and put things in perspective. If I suffer some kind of difficulty or worldly problem in this life it probably fits into prarabdha or agama karma? But I was also thinking vasanas create added affliction. So my desires, suffering, unharmonious actions, even unrighteous actions and thoughts (resulting from vasanas) also compound the suffering in the current life. But in all these things how much is actually my responsibility? The only thing to do is to inquire and free myself of vasanas. My teacher was saying in the videos I posted that paraphrasing a flawed way of going about inquiry is to ignore all the misidentifications or self-definitions and perspectives that are responsible for patterns of thought, ignore them and go for the I-thought without that. Because tehn it just becomes a mental exercise. Experientially I found that profound. It is of course I think harder to actually inquire into the what I'm taking myself to be, because I'm addicted to it. Another mental exercise, practice actually can be just another way of staying in the inertia of tamas guna. I believe Mathru Sri Sarada talked about that. For instance, I in this life have Asperger's, and besides that have alot of tendencies that might be considered mental illness. Which is of course huge fuel for motivation for this practice? What other route of escape do I have? God or Ishwara set me up nice with no escape route but to earnestly and sincerely spiritually practice. That could be the same with others here. Maybe, I speculate, that is the driving force for people who are getting a little warmer in terms of Self-Realization. samsara, maya becomes more unbearable. Will not let you return into it as easily. I've even wondered if sadhana in a previous life set me up so that if i went with the ego (and desires), I would have enormous difficulties in this life. Which erroneously I did. That (the personal) aside, I found thinking about karma kind of fascinating, and it resonates with me as actually real.
For instance, the teacher I'm corresponding with, which at this point I have very little doubt is a qualified sat-guru (a jnani), it seems a big help of the jnani or sat-guru is in supplying the necessary power of the Self to overcome vasanas. For instance, the vasanas seem to have more power then the Self in my experience sometimes, it's almost like something really heavy has fallen and is driving me against a wall (a referigerator sliding down the stairs), into a corner, it is too heavy to push. The presence of teh enlightened being or sage supplies the grace which is almost like added pullies that help move the vasana or tendency. Overtime through a mix of that and the attempt at inquiry, the pullies start operating on their own. And so the vasanas are a little easier to move. I was also thinking about how in this same Ribhu Gita glossary it said Ramana Maharshi said Self-Realization does not only destroy sanchita and agama karma but prarabdha karma as well. A couple years ago when I first read that, I assumed that meant, because to the jnani it doesn't matter what happens phenomenally. But looking at how jnanis operate, it seems that the manifest life is also profoundly altered by Self-Realization. And so I wonder if that is the effect of really having no prarabdha karma. How did Maharshi, Papaji, and Robert Adams appear in more places then one at a time. That also seems to me, to maybe be that they are no longer bound by prarabdha karma. They really are no longer an embodied being in teh typical sense, bound by a life-story arc. I actually personally had an experience that verifies for me this ability of the sage to be in more places then once. (preface: I'm not claiming to be spirituallly mature), in my early twenties when I was having these experiences that terrified me where the world seemed to be an extension of my imagination, I recall one time where freaked out by this, I was walking my bike, and a woman I had met in Portland came up to me and said that she had known me in Boston and we were good friends there (I had never been to Boston). That really freaked me out. It mightn't have, except for the fact that I was looking for some verification that the world is real. I think this may have been because of some sort of Self experience of some sort, and that I literally had been in more then one place at a time. When I read Robert Adams describing multiple examples of this, it really resonated with that phenomenon I had experienced. Not to brag. Kind of fascinating.
I think it would be really hard to be deluded as to whether one is Realized or not. I've had higher experiences but they've rarely been all that effortless and definitely not permanent. When effortless and permanent, then I would know that I was I guess abiding as the Self.
Thank you for your detailed explanation of my questions.
I wrongly interpreted the sentence 'The word that is translated as "knowledge" is Tamil equivalent of "jnana"' in the note of 'who am I?' in this site.I see that 'jnana' is a Sanskrit word.
Then, can 'arivu' be translated into both 'knowledge' and 'consciousness'?It seems 'jnana' means '(true) knowledge' and not 'consciousness'.
Is 'arivu' a wider concept than 'jnana'?
About verse 19 of Ulladu Narpadu, in 'collected works' 'taan' seems to be translated into 'Self'.I think this interplatation isn't wrong.
I think Bhagavan said everything(ego,world,god and maybe freewill and fate that is the concepts of ego etc) emanated from the Self.In this sense I think the Self can be considered as source of fate and freewill.
About verse 21, I also think it is right to say that individual can't see the Self, strictly speaking.But I think it is possible bhagavan used the expression like 'see the Self'.
I think he sometimes used such expression like 'realize the Self' and also said that there is nothing to realize and the Self alone is.Sometimes bhagavan used the expression that objectify the Self outwardly.
In contrast to my evident egotism, here is something my teacher said, I was just reading it and thought it was good. It was in a book that contains his new translation of Ramana's 40 verses. I'm kind of excited by that, because I believe him to be Realized.
But this was in a satsang transcript discussion, I thought he made some points that were stunning to me, and had a profound impact on me.
Q: I do not understand the experience of the eternal.
N: What is the definition of the one who does not understand the eternal? Where is his abode? Where does he dwell?
Q: He dwells in a time-bound body.
N: He seems to dwell in a mind and in a body. The mind and the body are not the conquerers of death. The body is born, and the body dies. The mind that is created is destroyed. Do not seek refuge there. Do not place your identity there. Do not place your hopes there. Do not place your hopes to find what is real, to find your happiness, and to find out who you are in the body and the mind. Seek refuge only in that which, being innately immortal, can conquer death. What is said about conquering death is true about conquering time. If you are in the mind, you are in time. It becomes obvious, even painfully so, that, if you are misidentified with the body, you are in time, but are you the body? Are you the mind? Where do you really dwell?
Q: How to make the inquiry most effective? When I do something that I think is inquiry, I know the answer to the question before I ask it. If I truly knew the answer to "Who am I?" I would not be asking it. I find it helpful to assume that I do not know who I am, and ask the question from there. But I know that I exist; I cannot not know that.
N: Yes.
Q: What I find to be effecitve when I inquire, "Who am I?" is to assume that I really do not know the answer to that and really try to find out.
N: It is because you then rely on experiential knowledge rather than an image or an idea. The idea, "existence," is far, far, far removed from actual Existence.
Q: It is so far removed, it is not even close.
N: This is gernerally true of everything of a spiritual nature. The idea of bliss is not the experience of Bliss, and the experience of Bliss does not care one bit for the idea about bliss. Likewise, the idea of consciousness has nothing to do with Consciousness. All of your inquiry, and that which is truly Knowledge, is purely experiential. If, in your mind, you think, "I know this," and you are not immediately, then and there, having the experience of the perfect fullness of Truth, you do not really know. It is just empty echoes in the mind. When you start with existence, as you described, you start with experience, and when you question, "Who am I?" you pursue experiential real Knowledge. When you say to yourself, "I know that," but you do not really have clear Knowledge of who knows that, further inquiry is worthwhile. The approaches are not even related to each other. Can you see this?
Q: Yes, one is looking for a "what," which is spiritually useless. The other one is looking for one who is looking.
N: Yes. So, the first one leaves the "I" solidly intact. It is an illusion, but it is being left solidly intact. In the other, the "I" is the first to die.
Q: It is totally different. Instead of accumulating something, in terms of more objective knowledge, you are eliminating the very core.
N: There is dissolution of the very knower who would be involved in the accumulating.
Q: We are getting rid of the accumulator
Translation of I believe verse #1
Can there, indeed, be the belief (faith, firm conviction, idea) of existence without that which exists?
In the Heart, free from (devoid of) thoughts, this is called the Heart. How to think of (remember) (lit., How can we remember) that immeasurable one?
Remembrance of htat, therefore, is, indeed, firm abidance (alone).
(Or: Rememberance of that is firm abidance therein alone)
"And Bhagavan said that only ripe soul can do self-enquiry.I have no confidence in my ripness.All I can say is that I have interested in self-enquiry.I hope I have qualification for self-enquiry."
Ramana said that anyone who is actually interested in self-enquiry is ripe enough to practice it - that's the sign of being ripe. No other qualification is necessary as far as he is concerned. It is simply a natural process that those who develop the qualifications for self-enquiry end up becoming interested in it and begin to experiment with it.
There's no need for self-doubt about your qualifications for self-enquiry, therefore. No one who is genuinely interested in it is unqualified to practice it.
some of my favorites. They are so good. I have to say there is something very nondualistic in even my teacher's use of language.
The 2nd prayer... (this is maybe one of my favs even in the Osborne translation)
"For those who have taken refuge, out of fear of death, in the Conqueror of death,
The "I" thought (notion) is the first to attain death. Thereafter, in them [who] are naturally (by their own nature) immortal,
How again can there be space for the thought of death?
Verse 1.
By all, an original (first) cause (original essence) of the universe (world) and of the "I"
It is said, the Lord (who is the powerful Master), someone with boundless power.
Variegated here (in this) (In this picture here), the seeing one (the seer) and the seen, and
The screen, and the Light, only (also) He, the One, became.
2. With naming the individual, the world, and the Supreme Self
Principles (verities), all suppositions (doctrines) begin.
(Or: Naming the individual, the world, and the Supreme Self is inherent in suppositions.)
This triad is so long as the "I"-notion will exist (be).
The best of all is abidance void of the "I"-notion ("I"-assumption).
3. True or false, this is consciousness or inert,
Suffering or happiness, thus to no purpose (vain) is the dispute (quarrel).
The world is not seen, no "I"-belief (no going toward the "I") (clear ascertainment of no "I")
Abidance without differentiation (without doubt), the Absolute (the Supreme) is aggreable for (dear to) all.
5. The body is of the nature of the five-fold sheaths (lit.: Which five-fold sheaths forming the nature is the body.)
Without that does the world shine?
Without the five-fold body, that, this here (now),
Who at all see the world? Let them speak.
6. [Of] the form of sound and others is the entire world. The existence of sound and others is a mode of the senses made to appear (brought to light).
The existence of the senses in the mind's power (control) is.
Full of the mind (Composed of the mind) is that world, we say. (or: Full of the mind, therefore, the world is, we say.)
7. With the idea (thought, intelligence, mind) rises, with the thought (mind) sets.
The world. Therefore, of the mind's (thought's) light is this.
The abode (glory, splendor, light) [in which] the mind and world are born and decay (are destroyed, perish) is the perfect fullness,
The real thing (the true Reality), devoid of birth and decay (destruction, perishing), the One.
8. Let them be spiritual practices for the vision (darshanam) of Truth,
Worship (plural) of the Supreme with name and form.
Abidance in the true Reality, the Attainment of that Self-Being (or: Abidance in the True Reality, the attainment of the state ((conviction)) of That is the Self),
Alone is the vision of Truth (true vision). Thsu know (understand).
9.
All dualities [and] all triads,
[On] some thing (Reality) depending (on some thing taking support), shine.
(All dualities and triads shine for some thing ((some reality)) that is the support ((for some thing upon which they depend)))
[When] that is traced (sought), all are loosed and dropped.
For them who see the Truth (Being), there is no movement ever (at any time).
(Not to them who see the Truth is there movement ever.)
10. How can knowledge shine if there is not ignorance?
Without knowledge, does ignorance shine?
And "Whose are the two?" thus. Inquiring into the source (root),
Abidance in one's own (true) nature is the Knowledge of the Supreme Truth.
11. Can that knowledge that does not know the one who knows oneself (the Self)
Be Knowledge of the Supreme Truth?
(or: Can that knowledge which is of one who does not know the Self ((oneself)))
(or: Can that knowledge that does not know the Self, the one who knows,)
Of knowing and of knowledge (or: the to be known), the support, oneself,
The one who knows shall destroy the two.
12. Sleep is not knowledge. Perceiving (sensing, seizing, grasping, taking into the mind) is not knowledge.
One does not grasp (seize, perceive) anything in true Knowledge.
Different from teh categories of sleep and perceiving is Consciousness alone (indeed); Knowledge shines forth [and is] not a void.
13. The truth is the Consciousness-Self. Various (manifold) forms of Consciousness
Are not established (accomplished) apart (different).
True Consciousness is not divided.
(lit, The Truth is he Consciousness-Self. It is various ((manifold)) forms of Consciousness that are established (as) apart ((different)) [yet] true Cosnciousness is not divided.
(or: The Truth is the Consciousness-Self. Various ((manifoled)) forms of Consciousness are not established as apart [or] divided [from] the true Consciousness.)
Can the change (transformation, modification) of ornaments exist truly
Without the gold, seperately (apart), here in this world?
That's enough for now. I really feel it reading these, almost more then the Ribhu Gita. Intoxicating.
Wait, there are some more really good ones. This one says so much about inquiry.
28. Just as in a well of water into [which one] has dived deeply, just so, within
One must dive (plunge) with intellect highly (extraordinarily) sharp,
Prana and speech to be controlled (lit., having controlled), inquiring (reflecting on);
One shall find the nature of the root one's own ego.
35. The Knowledge of the established Truth (Being) alone is accomplishment.
Comparable to (resembling) a dream, indeed, are other accomplishments.
The dream of one who is awakened, how can it now be true?
Does one who abides in Truth (Being) again approach illusion.
.
... http://www.thakor.freeserve.co.uk/jivan.htm ...
Great, Ravi! Thank you. And for your mentioning of Brother Lawrence too. The german translation of it was very important for many seekers here.
By the way: The german translation of Swami Venkatesanandas Vasisthas Yoga is now in the caring hands of Sivanandas Rishikesh Ashram and is expected to be published by the german branch.
.
Rereading K.k. Nambiar. He had an amazing connection with Ramana Maharshi through dreams; often very instructive dreams.
Nambiar would sometimes concentrate on the tip of the nose or between the eyebrows. Ramana told him to meditate on the heart centre. "Why not go directly to it?"
I don't know if this is standard, but brackets in the translation I was quoting mean words inserted to make it intelligible in english. Parenthesis means alternative nuances or words that could be used there. In the introduction it was saying, if one wants to make it flow better poetically they can choose the words out of those to use.
This was in response, my teacher in these satsang transcripts about the 40 verses on What is. The guy almost crashed his plane. I found some it very interesting, in an earlier dialogue I had kind of a revelation about how, in the commentary on Prayer 1, in every experience you can go back to just the sense that there is pure Existence and that everything is dependent on it.
N: Does the knowledge, training and application of those physical skills require an ego-entity who believes he is half-Existence-and-half-a-body? Cannot all those things be accomplished quite well without an ego?
Q: It is obvious the ego does not help, because the fear and the panic just cloud the correct response. Is the ego of any value at any time?
N: How could there be value in an illusion? That is like asking, "Is the mirage water good for any kind of irrigation?" (laughter)
"Can we water these crops, or can we swim in it?" (laughter)
Q: No. The mirage does not have any value.
N: It does not produce anything, and it does not do anything. It is just a conjurer of illusion. Similarly, one would not measure your abidance as the Self by the physical reponses.
Q: No. They do not define it.
N: Abidance does not mean that the body always has the perfect physical response in each situation. It does not mean that you will not respond. An idea that abidance as the Self means that one is non-responsive, that is, that the body is always in a state of inertia, is not true.
Q: It is freeing to see that. There have been times when I have used fear of something to drive myself to do something.
Most of the time, it is not useful. I hae asked myself, "Who is it that is afraid of something? Who is this entity that is afraid of whatever?" It is obvious that it is the ego. Existence never has that experience.
N: When you are afraid, is it not because you think your happiness will perish, or be taken away in some manner or another? Yet, is it so?
Q: It is not so.
N: Can actions be done without fear, in the fullness of happiness from beginning to end?
Q: Yes. I think that is the case, and I am thinking about if the ego really helps. The deeper my practice becomes, the less fear and the more bliss I have.
N: Yes.
Q: When I first started this practice several years ago, there was a great deal of suffering, and there were not many breaks in the suffering. Now, it is the other wya, for there is as much happiness, bliss, and freedom.
N: Does not that bliss act as a continuous drawing to you to realize it continuously, so there is no interruption in it?
Q: It is actually more effective than fear for me at this point.
N: Maybe, the motivation is not different.
Q: The motivation is to be free continously without a break.
N: To be free continuously, and to thus be happy, or blissful, continously without a break, is the motivation that, when you did not know better, manifested as fear.
The wise know how to make good use of the experience without placing emphasis on only the objective portion of the experience, so that we do not think of it as solid or as a thing in itself.
Notice that the instruction is about where to seek refuge from the fear of death and how one finds the answer in one's own Existence. If the answer is found, the fear of death will then, obviously vanish by itself, without even the space for the thought of it. Notice that Sri Bhagavan does not advocate suppression of the fear of death, such as merely not thinking of it or some other silly approach.
Q: And he does not advocate trying to make it worse.
N: No. Death is already universal. We do not need to make it worse. Everyone born dies. The instruction of the wise takes up the apparently present existence, turns the mind inward, and drives you to the essence of the pure Existence, without any emphasis whatsoever on the belief in the so-called present experience. By conclusion of the verse, Sri Ramana has revealed how there is no more room even for the thought of the fear of death, but the fear of death has been made good use of, for purposes of pointing out the Immortal. Do the same for yourself with all experience. If even the fear of death, as intense as that can be, can be made use of so wisely, as the Maharshi has amptly demonstrated and taught in this verse, certainly everything else can be approached in the same way. Every other suffering can be regarded as a minor reflection or version of the same.
Q: From this conversation, worry seems to be the fear that, sometimes in the future, I am going to lose my happiness.
N: Yes, and since you are thinking of the future in the present, you suffer right then and there. You dot wait. It is merely a minor version of the same thing.
Q: This really helps to clarify fear and suffering, where it comes from, and what the obvious solution is.
N: The Maharshi has very graciously and wisely summed that up in one verse. Not only has he set the example, but, in one verse, he has concisely, fully taught it.
(Silence)
Though these first two verses of the Maharshi's intruction are considered the invocation, the prayer, if the significance of what has been imparted and implied in these two verses is comprehended deeply within yourself, this, in itself, will be adequate to meet all of your spiritual needs.
Now, in his Grace, and in his all seeing Eye of Knowledge, he will expound the Truth further and more fully, for it is Sat-Darshanam, revealtion of Reality. If you understand your own deathless Existence, without which there could not even be the idea of something existing, let alond something actually existing, and thus recall what your real nature is, what more need be accomplished? In this way, before he actually commences the instruction of the text, he has already revealed the Truth, just as, before he spoke, in his Silence, the Truth was already revealed.
(Silence)
Prayer 1
Can there, indeed, be the belief (faith, firm, conviction, idea) of existence without that which exists?
In the Heart, free from (devoid of) thoughts, this is called the Heart. How to think of (remember) (lit., How can we remember) that immeasurable one?
Remembrance of that, therefore, is, indeed, firm abidance (alone).
(Or: Remembrance of that is firm abidance therein alone.)
Prayer 2
For those who have taken refuge, out of fear of death, in the Conquerer of death,
The "I" thought (notion) is the first to attain death. Thereafgter, in them [who] are naturally (by their own nature) immortal,
How again can there be space for the thought of death?
More from my teacher's translation of 40 verses on What is,in the book Saddarsanam. 40 verses are the best piece of writing ever written in my opinion.
14. "That" and "you" have "us" for a firm basis.
Upon the destruction of that "us" from (by means of) the knowledge of the root (source),
Without the "that," "you," and "us" notion, the One State (Abidance, Stand) shines, the innate Self shall be.
15. The past (the having been, the gone) and the future (the to become) are the present (being) in [their] own time. Relinquishing the Truth of what is presently existing (the present),
Will it not be laughable, repeatedly thinking over (discussion) [what is] gone [and] will be,
Like counting without the number one, in the world?
16. Where shines (appears) talk of space (direction) and time without us?
The play of space and time, here, is if we are the body.
Nowhere we shine (appear) at no time we shine (appear),
But we everywhere and always shine.
17. In the body being the Self, the wise (the knower) and the ignorant (the unintelligent) are alike (the same).
(or: In the state of the body-self, the wise and the ignorant are the same).
For the one, in the body, in the heart, the Self illumines,
Including (encompassing, spreading over) the body and the universe, the Perfect Fullness.
For the other, the Self is discernible as only the body (the Self is only the measure of the body).
18. For the ignorant and for the wise, the universe is (exists).
For the former, the seen universe, indeed (alone), is the real (the true).
For the other, the seen the resting place has become; the One, The Real (the Truth), the completely Full, shines as formless.
(or: For the other, the One that has become the resting place of the seen,
The Real, the completely Full, the Formless, shines.)
19. The talk (controversy) of fate and of effort (striving) shall be for
Them who do not know the root of these two.
For those who know well the root thing of fate and effort,
There are not, indeed, fate or one's own activity (free will).
20. That seeing of the Lord [that is] the seer
Not seeing, that shall be mental seeing.
Not other than the seer is the Supreme, indeed. Of Him
The seeing is in one's own source (root) the absorption (lit. having been aborbed, dissolved) and abidance.
21. See the Self, see the Supreme;
Thus, the Agama (the scripture's) declaration. This is not an easy bhava (state, meditation, contemplation). (or: This is easy, not a way of thinking.)
If the SElf is not, indeed, the seen, how can there be talk of the Lord? (how to seek the Lord?)
Oneself becoming His food is that seeing (is seeing Him).
22. In the mind, the Light the Supreme grants (gives) (lit., having given),
Oneself (Himself) within the mind (or: interior to the mind), He shines hidden.
The mind is to be turned back within (interior to) the mind, here.
From the union (absorption) is the seeing (wisdom) of the Lord, not otherwise.
23. The body does not say "I," thus. In deep sleep, Non one says, "I did not exist," thus.
Upon the rise of that (which), all arise. Of that "I," with the mind (intelligence), investigate (make clear) the birth place.
Today we remember Annamalai Swami.
I remember reading when Ramana Maharshi was near the end; gossips
came to him complaining" Annamalai has not come to visit you."
Ramana replied" you are here but your mind is there" "Annamalai is there but his mind is here"
Every answer Ramana Maharshi gave was a mahavakya.
Thanks for the timely reminder about Annamalai Swami's fifteenth death anniversary (November 9th). I spoke to Sundaram, Annamalai Swami's interpreter and ashram manager, a couple of weeks ago. He told me he was planning to organise a commemorative lunch for the villagers who supported Annamalai Swami for many years. The function will be today, on the pradakshina road, near or possibly in Nityananda's Ashram.
For those who are interested, yesterday was also the anniversary of Mastan Swami's passing away in 1931.
>>Today we remember Annamalai Swami.
Thank you very much indeed.
Are there any stories about Annamalai Swami that you discovered after he passed away or just not published in 'Living by the words of Bhagavan'? May Annamalai Swami remain blissfully as the Self.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUiu7tEX5kg&feature=related
Krishnamurti clip that is positively beatific. Showing his guru/jnani nature.
background music I was using.
http://video.google.com/videosearch?hl=en&source=hp&q=amelie%20soundtrack&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wv#
admiring the beauty of jnanis is very much spiritual practice.
Dear David
It is a wonderful experience reading about devotees who were absorbed in Bhagwan, like Annamalai Swami.
thank you for leaving us with " Living By The Words of Bhagwan " and " Final Talks ". Both were uplifting.
yours truly
Ramos/Friends,
"of Brother Lawrence too. The german translation of it was very important for many seekers here.
By the way: The german translation of Swami Venkatesanandas Vasisthas Yoga is now in the caring hands of Sivanandas Rishikesh Ashram and is expected to be published by the german branch."
God Bless you Ramos for your labour of Love in translating these works into German and making it available to all seekers.
Thanks to Heavy rains in chennai,my internet connection was cutoff for a few days.
Nice to know that Sri Sundaram had organized a special Lunch for those devotees of Sri Annamalai Swami on his Aradhana Day.
I will share one incident from my memories of Sri Annamalai Swami:
I had an uncle who used to do Pranayama as part of his spiritual practice of Japa;he had been doing this for years.He started experiencing 'electric shock' like vibrations which he called 'Tremor' and Bodily heat which he initially attributed to stimulation of 'Kundalini' and tried to ignore it;however it continued for years.
On a summer morning in the late 1980s,when I started for Tiruvannamalai,he accompanied me.After visiting the Arunachaleswara temple and Sri Ramanasramam,we went to Sri Annamalai Swami around 17:00 Hrs.
Swami opened the Gate and received us saying-"The Younger Swami(Sri Sundaram)has gone to attend Rajiv Gandhi's speech(Rajiv Gandhi,the then Prime minister of India was in Tiruvannamalai on that day)".After introducing my uncle,I mentioned to Swami about his 'Practice' and experiencing of 'Tremor' and 'heat'.Swami listened and remarked pointing to his chest-"In the path shown by Bhagavan,one only experiences 'coolness'(KuLirchi-in Tamil)here".
In the course of conversation,Swami observed-"There are people who will set aside some money as offering to Deity(swami);they then uilise this money for some emergency,deferring the depositing of this amount in the 'Hundi'(The Collection Box found in temples for visitors to drop currency coins).These people say-"After all it is our 'Own Swami';What difference does it make if we deposit the money Later!"
Interestingly this is what happened with me on this occassion.I had set apart some cash to be offered to Sri Annamalai Swami during this visit;I was on a vacation to chennai(I was staying in Dehradun, in North India)and ran out of cash!Those were days when one did not have the ATM facility and had to carry sufficient currency to last for the period of Vacation.I had to postpone handing over the offering to swami;later I sent it through Money order post.
Now Swami did not even seem to be 'pointing' to this 'decision' of mine.It just occured naturally as part of that conversation.This was the only such occassion that this happened.
Likewise Swami gave total freedom to Sri Sundaram to visit any place-Be it A Political speech or a Philosophical Talk (Sri Sundaram used to visit Chennai to attend JK's Talks).Even to say that he 'gave Total Freedom' is not correct-Swami never was a "guru" to give permission or deny it.He is ever himself.
-----------------------------------
Namaskar.
Ravi, Thank you for the beautiful
stories and memories of Annamalai Swami. I visited him a couple of times and even took my kids along to see him. Later I took the children to see Ram Surat Kumar as well. Being from the west I'm not sure what impact it had on them on a deeper level.
Anonymous,
It is indeed providential good fortune to meet Great souls-you and your children are Blessed.I had the opportunity to have 'Darshan' of Yogi Ramsurat Kumar twice-The last time was when his statue was shaping up in his new asram.The Yogi was sitting near his statue and people were prostrating to the statue!Round about this time,the Yogi was not as accessible as he used to be in earlier years(as I am given to understand by others who had seen him in his earlier days).I never got to exchange a word with him.
With Annamalai Swami,it was like meeting a 'Friend' from your village/town.Swami was totally unassuming,simple and a wonderful host;when he smiled it was more through his eyes than his lips!In the course of a discussion if you understand a point,he would strike his Right palm over his left and point to you as if to say 'There you are!You got it!'-in childlike glee.
In 'Living By the words of Bhagavan'David had beautifully captured how even in recounting stories about his several encounters with the Sarvadhikari of SriRamanasramam,Swami always did so with a wry humour without a trace of rancour.
Also,how Swami gave a big Grin when David mentioned about the title that he chose-'Living by the words of Bhagavan'.
I used to visit Swami after visiting Ramasramam-and Swami like a child will go through the books that I bought at Ramanasramam-identifying the people in the photographs in those books.
Swami always responded promptly to all letters-The Replies were drafted by someone as Swami spoke;Often Swami not satisfied with this,would again start writing on his own all over again filling all the Space Left in that Letter.A constant Refrain in these letters -'Body is not 'I';Thoughts are not 'I';Atma I am.Do thou forever contemplate thus and attain that state of Changeless Bliss.
He would also advise writing this in a notebook as a Japa.I once wrote a Letter with just this content!Swami was very happy and responded as If I had attained what I had written!
-----------------------------------
Thanks very much Friend. Remembering swami is to invoke his Blessings.
Namaskar.
Body is not I, thoughts are not I. do thou forever contempate and attain that state of changeless bliss.
I was reading quotes of Annamalai swami on Google. There were some good ones. One was about how summa iru does not mean physically still. And he was saying in sattva guna there is pristine harmony, and if mental activity is necessary it happens, for the rest of the time there is mental silence. I was having some luck with that. Then of course, I end up back in ego, and all sorts of nonsense. But trivializing the objects of thought, and then dissolving 'me' in pure being there is a pristine glowing billowing clouds of bliss silence, and if I could stay there, things will happen, and responses will naturally occur. This must be related to what is meant by not being the doer of actions. It's not that I'm any less a doer then I already was. The not being a doer, is because the responses will occur still but out of that silence. The silence being because there is nothing worthy of arising as an egoic "I" and worrying about, as opposed to a dull, repressive silence. For me, what happens also, is that sometimes my vision becomes glowing white, so that sometimes the background objects are drowned out in the white, radiant vision. I try to make methods of things, sometimes that works, and sometimes it doesn't. Lately, I've had some success with things like treating anything finite, non-infinite, or temporary, non-eternal as non-real. And that I am the all-encompassing, infinite (as in further then the furthest objects), always. The objects that appear to me are finite, smaller then the infinite, which they say is who I really am. So they are an infintesimal part of me, the objects that appear around. This also seems to work with obessive thoughts (which I've struggled with). Just the question or noticing whether they are infinite or eternal, makes them disappear. Because then it becomes clear, how worthy is something that is going to be temporary (or finite given the vast universe), no matter how enticing, or attached I am. This gets me somewhat off the attachment level. And because of that a deep peace, and contentment starts to take over. Sometimes i have to let go of mental concentration (unless it arises on it's own, or is needed for a task), lately I've been treating that as pseudo-spiritual practice, and dullness producing. Or if practice becomes a repetitive mental mode I stop that, because the key is wanting to become mentally still, without a ripple and at peace, spiritaully, totally content, which means getting off the level of worry. Then who am I? can sometimes dissolve the remaining sense of individuality, then I get really quiet, perhaps savikalpa samadhi. If I keep this up long enough, I've had a few rare instances of an even much deeper silence that I can't describe, maybe that is nirvikalpa samadhi. But not often. I would think, taht what leads to Realization itself, is, it is identical to samadhi, and samadhi is realized as natural, as in, the other tendencies were un-natural. For this to happen, for me to go from some of these deeper states to sahaja, I'm guessing that that is a matter of really continuing this until all the sporadically arising tendencies (and dramas and problems) weaken, and no longer come back.
The annamalai swami anecdote Ravi brought up, reminded me of interactions with my teacher. The thing that resonated, was that the selfless and highly functional nature in helping others spiritually, and I love that refrain.
Is there a new Brunton book out containing new, unreleased photos of Ramana Maharshi, Yogananda and Meher Baba?
I also have to mention Krishna Swami and his austere life style.
When I met him he was very old. His task was to feed the animals and monkeys. He was very joyful despite the conditions he lived in.
He would wait for stragglers outside the dining hall and only go in when all were seated.
I remember his lovely, smiling face as he showed us around.
For some people, the way to Bhagavan's lap is via Papaji's lap.
Thanks for introducing to Annamalai Swami.
Saw Jim's interview with Annamalai Swami (available in Youtude and Veoh) and ........ almost like listening to Bagawan Ramana...
Thanks
Prakash
.
Perhaps one of the india based people here know where to get some of the paintings of the original Yoga Vasistha manuscript (like this)?
I need 4 oder some more (royalty free) to decorate the translation of Yoga Vasistha.
.
from a letter of Thomas Merton to Catherine de Hueck Doherty, September 18,
1958
thanks to Father Patrick Collins, thomasmerton@onelist
"After so boldly advertising to the world that I was out to become a
saint, I find I am doing a pretty bum job of it...
"But it certainly is a wonderful thing to wake up suddenly in the
solitude of the woods and look up at the sky and see the utter nonsense
of everything, including all the solemn stuff given out by professional
asses about the spiritual life: and simply to burst out laughing, and
laugh and laugh, with the sky and the trees because God is not in words,
and not in systems, and not in liturgical movements, and not in
"Contemplation" with a big C, or in asceticism or in anything like that,
not even in the apostolate. Certainly not in books. I can go on
writing them, for all that, but one might as well make paper airplanes
out of the whole lot."
Friends,
'At the Feet of Bhagavan' by Sri T K Sundaresa Iyer is a gem of a little book that captures the essence of Sri Bhagavan's wonderful life and Teachings in an intimate way.How the Five Hymns to Arunachala came about is revealed in this excerpt( a longish one and this may have to be split into a few posts):
28. HOW THE “FIVE HYMNS TO
ARUNACHALA” CAME ABOUT
TO be calm and know “I AM THAT I AM”, is really
Bhagavan’s one work. The inmost core, the Heart,
the Divine shining all alone as ‘I-I’, the Self-aware, is He.
This centre simply IS; It is all Knowledge and all Bliss. It
is from here that all begin to manifest, and in It all get
lost. Being Itself That, It is all peace; no discord is there
since the ‘I’ or ego does not arise and has no ‘he’ or ‘you’
to oppose. Being the ever-present and all-pervading, the
Supreme ‘I’ is the Lord, Ramana who ever rejoices.
This state of Pure Bliss is the Supreme Man; the Truth
Absolute is such as cannot be hidden under any cover. It
spreads far and wide, and attracts to Itself kindred or
seeking souls. It is Stillness, eternally expressive. Others
can know it, enjoy it, but cannot know its fullness nor Its
source. They long to know, but the Stillness is unbreakable.
Their longing grows and becomes an agony.
This Stillness, diamond hard, is milky kindness and at
last responds. First it stirs, finds voice, and lisps a syllable or
two. Though pregnant with fire and penetrating like light,
the Voice seems like the prattle of a child. Then, gradually
attuned, it picks up its chords and trickles out — first as a
small gentle stream, then expanding like the majesty of
the Ganga, fertilising the soul by the waters of its songs,
74 At the Feet of Bhagavan
and surpassing itself in revealing the placidity of ocean
depths.
Such is the origin and the growth of Sri Bhagavan’s
spoken words, which have been gathered up in the form
of published works.
“Aksharamanamalai” (The Marital Garland of Letters)
first and foremost of His hymns to Arunachala, came out
in response to the prayers of his sadhu-devotees for some
distinctive prayer songs which they could sing on their
rounds for alms. Usually, when Sri Maharshi’s devotees
went around singing common songs, the householders in
the town knew that the food was being partaken of by
Sri Bhagavan; and they gave large quantities of food, as
against a single morsel given to other groups of sadhus.
Knowing this, a few unscrupulous beggars began to pose
as the Ramana group and created difficulties for them. To
get over this difficulty, there was felt the need for a
distinctive prayer-song.
When the request for such a song was made, Bhagavan
as usual kept quiet and for a long time there seemed to be
no prospect of their desire being fulfilled. But during one
of the processions round the Hill, there blossomed forth
from Sri Bhagavan the 108 sweet flowery verses strung
like a marriage garland for Arunachala, the Lord of the
Heart. These songs are like the outpourings of a pining
soul to her lover, and they are no less ardent than Saint
Manickavachakar’s for Siva. These and other soul-stirring
hymns of Sri Bhagavan are the delight and solace of His
devotees, who sing them to this day in the Hall.
continued...
Friends,
Excerpt from 'At the Feet of Bhagavan' continued....
The following few verses, though a poor rendering
from Tamil, amply gather in our hearts to the Lord:
1. “O Arunachala, Thou hast entered into me,
drawn me and kept me enclosed in the cavity
of Thy Self; why is this?
2. “For whose sake didst Thou accept me as a
lover? Do not abandon me, or the entire world
would blame Thee.
3. “Avoid this blame. Why didst Thou at first
make me remember Thee? Hereafter I can
never abandon Thee.
4. “Take away this garb of mine; make me naked,
and then clothe me in the raiment of Thy
Grace.
5. “Be seated there in me; let the ocean of Bliss
ebb, and let words and feelings subside in me.
6. “If Thou gather me not in Thy arms, my whole
being will melt in tears and perish.
7. “There is no room for laughter (at my ugliness).
Bedeck me with Thy Grace, me who has sought
Thee, and then see.
8. “Let us cling together without distinction of
‘Thou’ and ‘I’, at rest in eternal Bliss; grant
Me that State.
9. “Let me not dangle like a green creeper with
nothing to hold; be Thou my support and save
me.
10. “Come, let us be happy in the home of empty
Space, void of night and day!”
76 At the Feet of Bhagavan
The following few verses contain a profound
Philosophy:
1. “Thou art the eye of the eye, and seest without
the eye; who then can see Thee; O Arunachala?
2. “Thou art the food of all; I shall draw near to
Thee and become Thy food, and then shall I
go in peace.
3. “Thou art alone the Truth, and shalt Thyself
reveal Thyself.
4. “I thought of Thee and fell into Thy Grace;
and, like a spider in its web, Thou didst bind
and swallow me!”
...to be continued
Friends,
"Excerpt from 'At the Feet of Bhagavan' continued....
Next of the Hymns is the “Navamani Malai” (the
Nine Gems); these were born on different occasions, but
were strung together for their exquisite appeal to the Heart
of different hues. The first of these explains the Dance of
the motionless Arunachala, while the second equates the
term Arunachala with Existence-Consciousness-Bliss
(satchidananda). Here is a strange thing; while in other
holy Centres Sakti dances and Siva witnesses, here the
display of the Mother’s activities cease, and merge in Siva
that He may dance as Arunachala.
The “Pathikam” and the “Ashtakam” (Ten, and Eight
verses), which come next, are a group by themselves.
The former begins with the word ‘karunaiyaal’ (by
Thy Grace). This word had once been ringing in Sri
Bhagavan times out of number. He tried several times to
put it off, but it would not go. Again and again the word
shone out in Him, and so pressed itself on His attention,
At the Feet of Bhagavan 77
that at last He yielded to penning it. Once started, the
stream began to flow, and it flowed into ten beautiful
verses. Sri Bhagavan then thought that the course of the
flow had fulfilled itself, but it had not yet finished. It still
flowed on, changing form, dimensions and contents, and
so built itself up into the “Ashtakam”. While the “Pathikam”
was more in the nature of an appeal for Divine Grace, the
“Ashtakam” is superb in that it explains in full and in such
minute detail the significance of Arunachala, the Absolute
Existence-Consciousness-Bliss, and how He, or IT, as the
‘I-I’ of our being transforms Himself into all that is
manifest. Incidentally, it also traces back the course, to
the Source to attain that state of Being which is supreme
Stillness (santi).
Let us listen to verses 10 and 11 of the “Pathikam”:
“I have found a wonder; It is a mountain magnet
that attracts life. Feel it but once, and It sets to rest the ills
of life; nay, It draws it to face Itself, makes it still, and
consumes the sweet life as an offering. Lo, what is This?
Know that and be saved, O men; this destroyer of souls
shines within as the great Aruna Hill.
“How many like me considered That as supreme and
were lost? O, you that have lost your love of this life
because its sorrows are so immense, and who wander in
the desire of swift death, think but once and casually of
that sweet Drug within, which kills without killing. Know
It on earth as the great Arunachala!”
to be continued...
For me, a guru is so necessary. All the little ways, that I go into delusion, but don't even recognize it. I was thinking about how another aspect is that I could read Talks with Ramana Maharshi and find it intensely inspiring and want to practice it, but really, one of the helpful things about 'keeping holy company', is that I can get advise about the gross issues. Because Self-inquiry itself is on such a subtle level. And if I'm suffering gross levels of emotional problems, those are big vasanas, and the Self-inquiry isn't going to be very fruitful if those are left intact. Everything from anger, sadness, fear, judgement, self-importance (assertiveness), self-judgement. Even though really, getting past that is included in the inquiry. And alot of times in Talks, no one asked the specific questions that pertain to individual issues I or someone else may suffer. There already down to the actual inquiry into the "I". When for me, there maybe was so much that I was dealing with that arises out of or is peripheral to the "I", that I'm intensely attached to, or suffering. And so it's hard to just dive straight in and inquire into the Self, the individual-less state, when there are so many things that are a result of the ego that I'm actually attached to, and can't keep my mind off of. Then it's like just a repression, or a redirection. When really Self-inquiry is advanced spirituality, someone said it's like the college of spirituality. (can't remember who?) I learned that I had alot of primary school issues. Alot of what is contained in other spirituality and religion is still applicable if there are the gross vasanas. Doing unto others, etc. A sage, can really it seems like deal with all those levels. And if, what they advise is earnestly practiced, then some of those gross levels of ignorance and suffering can relatively quickly clear, and then the inquiry into the Self can be fruitful or even successful. It really seems earnestness is the key factor. There has to be a willingness to be humbled, and to be a beginner or a willingness to become willing to be humbled or to become a beginner. If the homework is done at the primary school level, or there is a willingness to go back and do those requirements, it seems like it is easier. I'm realizing that I can't Realize the Self without actually becoming in a sense spiritually purified of all my other motives that are non-spiritual. I have found that besides writing my teacher and getting responses, which is immensely helpful, that the neti-neti approach, but not as in mentally counting everything, but just eliminating the non-eternal, and non-infinite as non-Self. To trivialize all the problems, as a discernment.
Friends,
"Excerpt from 'At the Feet of Bhagavan' continued...
And now let us turn to the sweet verses 6 and 7 of
the “Arunachala Ashtaka”:
78 At the Feet of Bhagavan
“Thou art the One — the Heart, the Source of all
knowledge and light. In Thee is the wondrous Power that
is not apart from Thee. The series of pictures embedded,
atom-like, in the film of Destiny (prarabdha) are by that
Power projected through thought and knowledge upon
the mirror-screen of the mind-light, and thereon display
the shadow-world pictures which are perceived by sense
organs within and without. O glorious Hill, Thou art like
the screen; those pictures seen through the lens, whether
they appear or disappear, are not apart from Thee!
“With the vanishing of Egoism, all thoughts vanish.
Till then, when other thoughts arise ask yourself to whom
they arise; ‘To me,’ the answer comes. Then question
further whence the I-thought springs, and thus dive
inwards and reach the seat of the Heart; then you become
the Lord. There are there, no dreams of dualities like ‘I’
and ‘You’, like virtue and vice, birth and death, pleasure
and pain, or light and darkness. In that Court, the Heart,
the Supreme One dances motionless — the Aruna Hill
the boundless Ocean of Grace and Light.”
Friends,
Concluding part of Excerpt from 'At the Feet of Bhagavan' :
The “Arunachala Pancharatna”, last of the hymnal series,
was first composed by Sri Bhagavan in Sanskrit, and
subsequently translated by Himself into Tamil verses. The
first stanza, commencing “Karunaa purna sudaabdhe”, alone
was casually written by Sri Bhagavan. Long afterwards,
someone showed it to Sri Kavyakanta Ganapati Muni, who
requested Him to write four more verses in the same arya
metre, the first being benedictory, the second on the Divine,
and the next three being on Jnana, Yoga and Bhakti.
At the Feet of Bhagavan 79
Thus it will be easily seen that these five gems form
a complete treatise in themselves, and they are also
devotional hymns giving immense consolation to those
who sweeten themselves by chanting them. Sri Kavyakanta
had planned to write an exhaustive commentary on these,
such as could compare with the famous “Maanasollaasa”
of Sri Sureswaracharya. But Providence took him from us
before he could carry out this plan. There is however a
good commentary in Sanskrit, by Sri Kapali Sastri called
“Arunachala Pancharatna Darpana,” published by
Sri Ramanasramam.
We quote verses 2 and 5 here, only as a sample:
“O Crimson Hill all these scrolls of painting arise,
remain and merge in Thee; the Seers call Thee the Heart
and Self, because Thou dancest in the Heart eternally
as ‘I’.
“Seeing Thee eternally through the heart surrendered
to Thee and seeing all as Thy form, he who does singleminded
devotion to Thee is victorious, being merged in
Thee.”
How clearly Sri Bhagavan has here explained the
Truth; may His devotees who benefit by reading this be
blessed!
Difficulties
Poem by Kabir
Friend, please tell me what I can do about this mud world
I keep spinning out of myself!
I gave up expensive clothes and bought a robe
But I noticed one day the cloth was well-woven.
So I bought some burlap but I still
Throw it elegantly over my left shoulder.
I stopped being a sexual elephant,
And now I discover I'm angry a lot.
I finally gave up anger, and now I notice
That I'm greedy all day.
I worked hard at dissolving the greed,
And now I am proud of myself.
When the mind wants to break its link with the world
It still holds on to one thing.
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